UK Covid Inquiry: John Swinney deleted messages from Nicola Sturgeon
Welcome to The Scotsman's live blog of the latest UK Covid Inquiry hearing in Edinburgh. Today we'll be hearing from Kate Forbes and John Swinney.
UK Covid Inquiry: Tuesday January 30
A quick recap
Here's a quick recap of what we learned yesterday, with Michael Gove and Jeane Freeman giving evidence.
Jeane Freeman's evidence
Former health secretary Jeane Freeman told the UK Covid Inquiry yesterday that she will regret for the rest of her life those deaths that occurred in care homes during the pandemic because of Scottish Government decision-making.
Ms Freeman, who stood down as an MSP in 2021, admitted the government’s response was “not as adequate” as she would have wished it to be.
It begins
Kate Forbes is up now, and after being sworn in begins her testimony.
It doesn't take long for WhatsApp messages to be brought up. Forbes has provided messages, the lead counsel for the inquiry, Jamie Dawson KC, says.
Forbes did not delete any WhatsApp messages from the pandemic, the inquiry hears, except from January 2022.
Tomorrow
Just a reminder that tomorrow we'll be hearing evidence from Nicola Sturgeon.
Our columnist John McLellan writes: "If they were selling seats it would be a hotter ticket than Taylor Swift at Murrayfield, so all eyes will be on the bulletins from the EICC on Wedneday, when ex-First Minster Nicola Sturgeon faces a full day’s cross-examination by Jamie Dawson KC at the Covid Inquiry.
"The stage has been set by explosive revelations in messages between Ms Sturgeon and her closest adviser Liz Lloyd, and the equally damaging conversations between national clinical director Jason Leitch and then Health Secretary Humza Yousaf."
Delegation
Tight decisions would be delegated to Nicola Sturgeon, Ms Forbes has told the inquiry.
"Often those decisions would be delegated to the first minister," she says.
"The bulk of decisions would always be made by cabinet, but when there were fine points that cabinet hadn't come to an agreement on that final decision would rest with the first minister."
Gold Command
Kate Forbes said she was “surprised” to learn that meetings of the Scottish Government Resilience Room (SGoRR) and the Gold command group had no minutes.
The former finance secretary said it was the first time she had heard of meetings not being minuted, when it was put to her by Jamie Dawson KC.
She said: “That surprises me and this would be the first of me hearing it.”
Mr Dawson said: “The reason we think that is the case is we have obviously asked the Scottish Government for all of its papers concerning these matters and although we have cabinet minutes, we don’t have minuted records of either of those groups.
“It becomes difficult to understand what the ultimate decision-making process was when there is no record of how those decisions were taken.”
Ms Forbes responded: “I can understand that frustration.”
An awkward Cabinet meeting
Ms Forbes was shown an exchange of WhatsApp messages between herself and Alyson Stafford, the director general of the Scottish Exchequer on December 14, 2021, which showed Ms Forbes discussing an “awkward” and “embarrassing” cabinet meeting where now First Minister and then health secretary Humza Yousaf had identified an additional £100m for business support from the health budget.
Ms Forbes wrote in the messages that it was “news” to her and to former first minister Nicola Sturgeon, and that she had never seen Ms Sturgeon “this angry in all my cabinets”.
Ms Forbes told Jamie Dawson KC she had been tasked with finding additional funding from any part of the budget for business support.
She said “surprises were never welcome” at cabinet and that Mr Yousaf was “trying to be helpful”, but the idea was not drafted in cabinet papers.
Lack of minutes
Former finance secretary Kate Forbes has said she was “surprised” to learn meetings of a key Scottish Government emergency group held during the Covid pandemic had no minutes.
Speaking to the UK Covid inquiry, Ms Forbes made the remark with regards to meetings of the Scottish Government Resilience Room (SGoRR) and the Gold command group.
PPE acquisition
Kate Forbes said the Scottish Government “kicked into gear” very rapidly when sourcing personal protective equipment (PPE) and ventilators at the beginning of the pandemic.
She told the UK Covid-19 Inquiry that she would not agree with the idea that more funding could be sought or looked for to move more quickly when preparing for the pandemic.
She said: “I am not sure I would agree with that.
“When it came to procuring PPE and ventilators, I would suggest the Scottish Government kicked into gear very rapidly, and it kicked into gear several months before we had actually acquired any funding.”
Ms Forbes said her colleague Ivan McKee started to look at Scottish supply chains for PPE and ventilators.
A new hope
Kate Forbes says the Scottish Government had hope that Scotland would exit lockdown in the summer of 2020.
Ms Forbes said: “I think, by April, we were looking at starting to emerge from the first lockdown and there was a lot of hope.
“At the time, our eyes were focused on getting to the summer and emerging from lockdown.”
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