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Bad weather - we have to get used to it



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Published Date: 10 January 2008
METEOROLOGISTS last night said Scots will need to learn to live with the extreme weather and the chaos it has brought to the country over the past few days, as the unpredictable effects of climate change begin to bite.
Experts from the Met Office told MSPs that the wetter winters and drier summers which would be visited on Scotland could bring "increased intensity of severe weather events" – such as flash flooding – in the years ahead.

They were speaking as Scot
land struggled to recover from the gale-force winds and torrential rain which have battered the country for almost 24 hours.

Hundreds of homes were still without power last night and the transport network had been badly hit, throwing the plans of thousands into chaos and causing misery for commuters.

As the wind whipped around Holyrood, politicians were told to expect major climate changes as a result of global warming.

Professor John Mitchell, the Met Office's director of climate change, said the rain would become more intense, which can cause flash flooding.

The environment and rural affairs committee was warned that only 50 per cent of Scotland was covered by high-resolution radars which could predict flooding. More than 90 per cent of England is covered by such technology.

Among the neglected areas is Moray, which has suffered devastating floods over the past decade.

Stephen Noyse, director of operations at the Met Office, said up to £15 million would be required to bring Scotland in line with England. He also recommended a new expert forecast centre be set up to coordinate action.

Mr Noyse warned that the chaos between agencies in the wake of last summer's flooding in England would be replicated north of the Border if there was such a disaster today. He said: "There's a real opportunity, I think, for Scotland to take a leading role in the UK to show what could be done.

"One of these is to invest in weather radars. But I think something more important would be to look at setting up a joint forecasting centre for floods, where organisations like Sepa (the Scottish Environment Protection Agency] and the Met Office are integrated to work together, to target investment and provide information to the public and emergency responders, and provide early warning of the event."

He said such a centre, with between ten and 20 members of staff, could be set up within six months if the agencies were tasked to do it.

Prof Mitchell agreed with John Scott MSP that extreme weather events which had previously happened once a century might now happen every ten to 15 years.

He said by the end of the century, temperatures would have increased by between 1 and 3.5C, and there would be more intense rainfall in both summer and winter.

Speaking after addressing MSPs at an inquiry into flooding and flood management, he told The Scotsman the temperature rise could be slowed if greenhouse gases were reduced.

He compared cutting the pollution to paying off a mortgage – although early contributions barely made a dent in the debt, a few years down the line they became very significant.

Met Office forecaster John Hammond added: "In general terms, climate change means droughts become more severe, summers become hotter and – the key for Scotland – winters become milder. Snow becomes less of a threat, but the other side is they become wetter as well."

IMPERFECT STORM CAME FROM NOWHERE

IT BEGAN to build silently over the Atlantic in the early hours of Monday – an area of low pressure that was barely a blip on the forecasters' radar.

At a point where warm air rose up to hit a cold front descending south, winds began to whip, working themselves up to gale force.

Furiously, the patch began to power north-west of Northern Ireland, spewing vicious rainstorms out on to Scotland, catching the evening commuters on their way home from work. The Met Office issued severe weather warnings and the nation braced itself for the onslaught.

The first casualty was at 11:30pm on Tuesday. Mark Bradshaw, 34, careered into the River Clyde after his car went off Greenock Road between Largs and Skelmorlie in Ayrshire.

A bank-bursting wave engulfed the car, driving it through the crash barrier. He was able to scramble through the smashed passenger-door window and back up the seawall to the road.

Just before midnight, while he was being treated at the scene for hypothermia, shock and bruises, the low pressure crashed into Argyll and Bute, unleashing gale-force winds and storms, before hurtling north-east along the Inner Hebrides to Sutherland and Cape Wrath.

At its lowest point, it had sunk to just 965 millibars: as one Met Office forecaster said, quite an impressive depth.

It sent gusts of up to 80mph and heavy rain into central, western and southern Scotland overnight.

Ferry services between Northern Ireland and Scotland were suspended and, when they restarted yesterday morning, were delayed by up to half an hour.

In Glasgow, where the gusts of wind hit peaks of 83mph, one of the city's best-known landmarks, the Great Eastern Hotel, was partially destroyed. Police closed off Duke Street in the East End at 2am after its roof was blown off, sending chunks of masonry on to the street below.

In Dundee, a section of the roof at Seabraes Hall, student accommodation in Seabraes Court, was blown off at about 3am, damaging cars parked below, as well as a lamp post.

At 3:45am, a train crashed two miles north of New Cumnock in Ayrshire when it struck a tree that had blown on to the line. The driver was taken to Ayr Hospital with minor injuries.

As the country began to rouse, the Met Office issued a severe weather warning of winds up to 80mph, with the prospect of structural damage, and the Forth Road Bridge was closed – although initially cars were allowed to continue to cross.

But by 9:40am, 8ft sections of a painting platform above the carriageways had been torn down by winds which reached 81mph. Some of the panels, weighing 77lb, hit a walkway and the total closure caused five-mile tailbacks at the alternative crossing, the Kincardine Bridge.

Snow was an additional problem on the A884 in Lochaber and high routes in Ross and Cromarty and Sutherland. Combined with ice, it made driving hazardous in Badenoch and Strathspey, and the ski road to the Cairngorms was shut due to stormy conditions.

The resort itself was stormbound due to winds which, at 10am, hit a peak of 140mph.

Blizzards also forced the Glenshee centre to shut.

At 10:08am, Highland Council reported four schools closed due to the weather, affecting 138 pupils; by noon, ten were closed, with 270 children sent home.

In the Western Isles, all 12 schools on Uist and Barra – with a total of some 940 pupils – were closed, and police warned motorists of hazardous driving conditions.

At Caledonian MacBrayne, Scotland's main ferry operator, nearly every service between the mainland and the islands ground to a halt late on Tuesday and early yesterday morning, with some cancelled for the duration of the day.

By 10am, it reported disruption to only two of its ferry routes, but later sailings to the Small Isles and Colonsay were cancelled and there was disruption to several other services.

Five of the firm's scheduled routes, from Mallaig to Canna, Ballycastle to Rathlin, Berneray to Leverburgh, Tayinloan to Gigha, and Oban to Kennacraig, were cancelled altogether yesterday.

Elsewhere, the Northlink Ferries Pentland Firth route saw two services, from Stromness and Scrabster, cancelled yesterday evening. Orkney Ferries also cancelled its late sailing to Rousay.

P&O Ferries services in Scotland were largely unaffected, with only minimal delays.

By mid-morning, the Skye and Kessock bridges had been closed to high-sided vehicles and the bridge to Scalpay in the Western Isles was also shut for a time in the morning. The Dornoch bridge was blocked when a lorry overturned. Further south, the Tay and Erskine bridges were closed to all traffic, and the Friarton bridge at Perth to all high-sided vehicles.

Tayside Police were inundated with calls. Trees and branches littered the roads, although few routes were closed for long.

However, train passengers suffered disruption and delays caused by a Scotland-wide 50mph speed limit.

All Dunblane-Edinburgh trains and half of those on the main Edinburgh-Glasgow line were cancelled because of mile-long flooding at Winchburgh in West Lothian, and damage to overhead power lines closed the routes between Glasgow, Ardrossan and Largs. Some 40 passengers on the London-Aberdeen sleeper had to be transferred to buses after it hit a tree at Leuchars in Fife, and two platforms at Edinburgh Waverley were closed after panes from the glass roof fell and smashed.

Some 20 flights, including British Airways services between Edinburgh and Glasgow and Heathrow and Gatwick, were cancelled.

The misery continued into the night, with energy firms still struggling to reconnect power to some of the 22,000 homes which had been cut off.

The reopening of the Forth Road Bridge at 6pm failed to ease major evening tailbacks which had built up on the M9.

As the low pressure drifted by, and forecasters issued soothing reassurances that today would be calmer, the taillights of hundreds of commuters' cars flashed around the Kincardine Bridge as they battled against long delays to get home.

• Additional reporting by Frank Urquhart, Martyn McLaughlin, Alastair Dalton and John Ross.



The full article contains 1594 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 09 January 2008 9:11 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Weather
 
1

weeshooie1,

Australia 10/01/2008 00:33:33
If last summer was anything to go by, it must have been very bad before :o(
2

Clan-destine,

Kyoto Japan 10/01/2008 00:34:48
Bad weather-we have to get used to it"Has Scotland ever had anything else but bad weather?{especially in winter} I think after a few thousand years of bad weather we're pretty much resigned to it by now and very much used to it....is this news? It's a bit like a headline that says "Jings!Ice found in Iceland!!"
3

Conan the Librarian™,

10/01/2008 00:43:20
3
Remember they just launched the "Green Issue".
There "will" be follow up articles...
4

Conan the Librarian™,

10/01/2008 00:57:47
3
Meant 2 of course.Bed now.
Was kept awake by all the noise last night.
And all the buckets falling over didn't help either.
5

Statsman,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 01:00:44
We never had bad weather in Scotland when I was a kid. It was all sunshine and magic love pixies. Damn this global warming!
6

Jock 107,

10/01/2008 01:03:26
Its the fault of the MWPs - they've devolved bad weather to us
7

DunCraig,

Brisbane 10/01/2008 01:18:17
"METEOROLOGISTS last night said Scots will need to learn to live with the extreme weather and the chaos it has brought to the country over the past few days, as the unpredictable effects of climate change begin to bite."

These meteorolgists must be babes in nappies! What evidence do the have, to espouse the theory that this weather event is due to the "unpredictable effects of climate change"? To me, it's nothing more than the usual January gales that sweep in from the Atlantic on a frequent, regular basis! I seem to remember a similar 'gale' ripping tiles off & chimney stacks landing on cars in the sixties! The more things change, the more they stay the same!
8

Navvy,

10/01/2008 01:32:35
"Ferries ground to a halt" I hope that they will be refloated without too much damage or delay

Forth Road Bridged closed all day. That is the best reason I have yet seen for building another bridge and not a tunnel
9

tomi,

10/01/2008 01:44:30
Was it not climate change that wiped out the dinosaurs?

10

Teofilio Cubillas,

On the Kincardine Bridge 10/01/2008 02:00:48
'Bad weather - we have to get used to it'

We are used to it - that's why we wear coats,hats and scarves in January, not surf gear and flip flops.....
11

Edward,

10/01/2008 02:36:39
'METEOROLOGISTS last night said Scots will need to learn to live with the extreme weather'
Absolute guff!
Not sure where these so called meteorologist have come from, but they certainly are not familiar with a Scottish winter. Gales, Snow, Rain etc is the normal weather during the winter period and nothing to to do with so called climate change
12

Guga II,

Rockall 10/01/2008 03:06:24
What a load of garbage.

Bad weather in Scotland in January, who'd have believed it? We never had gales, or hail or heavy rain or snowstorms in January in Scotland. It was always a sub-tropical paradise at this time of year.

What have these so-called meteorologists been smoking?
13

Birdie,

Foster City 10/01/2008 03:17:11
No.7 is so right. I am 82 years old and remember those winters with chimney pots flying all over the street. Scotland has never had mild winters.
14

John Blackley,

Austin, TX 10/01/2008 03:40:25
Oh for heavens' sake! A few roofs got blown off, a few thousand people lost power for a few hours and a few trains didn't run (now there's news!). Hardly Hurricane Bleedin' Katrina, is it?

But then, there's the whole point of this Chicken Little sermon, right there in the middle of the article: fifteen million quid and a new "expert forecasting center" (whatever that is when it's at home).

So, woe unto us! We're dooomed! Doomed, I tell ye! And, oh by the way, could I have a few million quid and a bunch more entrail-examiners and maybe it'll all be okay?
15

aberdeenshire teuchter,

perth, wa 10/01/2008 03:43:39
aye, just about on par for this time of year. sounds normal to me, trucks getting blown over, blizzards, bridges getting closed. Whats abnormal about that?
16

GalacticCannibal,

Murrieta, CA ......ex Mexican Territory 10/01/2008 04:10:02
2
Guga II,
Rockall

Dude ,

I know they were not eating shroom omelets washed down with Napa Valley red wine, from Calif.

One must be a masochist to live in Scotland in the winter.

Lousy weather, gales , rain , cold. and unending dark dreary gray stone houses and buildings.

Expensive food expensive gas (petrol), expensive booze (bitter), expensive everything, and no sunshine .

Its a suicidal receipt...... Dudes.

GC.
17

West Aus Hibee,

Perth, Western Australia 10/01/2008 05:30:21
As an Aussie, i have to say that i never really found Scottish winters that bad (although my wife and I lived in Edinburgh, so cant comment on life further north). In fact, while we were sitting at home on Boxing day here in Perth it reached 44C, and we looked at each other and said - "I'd take winter back in Edinburgh any day".....

and i really mean that!
18

weeshooie1,

Australia 10/01/2008 05:52:23
WAH #17,

Come off it, at least you can sit in air-conditioned comfort out here or go for a swim. The only snow I ever want to see will be on a Christmas card or postcard. I remember well enough being on permanent nightshift in the shipyard, standing waiting for a bus, snotters flee'in, cant feel yer toes, ears, nose, lips, fingers etc. Nah, I'd rather settle back wi' a slab of coldies any day, and watch the Boxing Day cricket.
19

West Aus Hibee,

Perth, Western Australia 10/01/2008 06:41:37
#18 haha yeah you have point, although one this i really loved about winters in Edinburgh was how it became dark quick after work, and the pubs always had this inviting glow. Also, the cold made the hot chippies taste even better. ahhh memmoooories
20

Kilted Hulk,

LaceyNW/USA 10/01/2008 06:57:46
Proud ofya my friends, before I got to the comments I thought, Oh Golly gee, I dont want to say what I thought, God BlessYa and I guess its true what I've heard if you want to make ledgend a wee bit stronger, then pitch in a couple of Scots.
21

Dave from Barra ©,

Western Isles 10/01/2008 07:32:21
Scotland gets bad weather? Whatever next? We will adopt the kilt as our national dress?

We have an oceanic climate. There is nothing "predictable" or "consistant" or "averagely nice" about that type of climate!

Last year was one of the warmest on record apparently. Except the summer temps were below average.

To be honest, I for one can no longer stomach this God Rotting rubbish.
22

Dave from Barra ©,

Western Isles 10/01/2008 07:34:23
GalacticCannibal

Almost right except our booze is relly cheap. That is why we have a little drink problem in Scotland, fuelled by SAD.
23

Media 1,

cape town 10/01/2008 07:38:22
Hahahahahaha!
Scotland needs to get used to bad weather? LMFAO
Who are these eejits who spout this sh1te?
Global warming my erse, its called weather and nature delivers it as she sees fit......
24

Russell M,

Stirling 10/01/2008 07:43:04
Bad weather in Scotland like never before catches infrastructure off guard?

Bridges closed to buses, trains speed limited, public transport - a viable alternative.

Like never before at these levels of cost, bureaucracy, taxation and intrusion into our lives.

Are we getting value for money?

25

jammy dodger,

Corstorphine, Edinburgh 10/01/2008 07:44:27
GalacticCannibal - you may be right about a few of those things....but I cant remember the last time a forest fire burnt down a town in Scotland or the last time the earth opened up and the M8 motorway disappeared into it. So it aint all milk and honey in your neck of the woods either.
26

an interested party,

10/01/2008 07:50:42
perhaps in days of yore we didn't build substandard buildings that couldn't withstand the weather, perhaps we paid more heid to the weather and didnt all ravel 20 miles to get to work.

scotland is well used to weather, it seems its contractors and designers that aint sussed it out yet
27

conservative,

Fife 10/01/2008 07:57:07
Oh for goodness sake we've had rain and gales every few years in the winter for as long as I can remember (and I'm 60-odd now). A right collection of prats these 'experts' who only seem able to stick their hands out of the window and say 'it's raining'.
28

Gilmartin,

Philippines 10/01/2008 08:01:30
Its all these sputniks that they're launching that are turning the weather upside down ;)
29

Nell,

Teh Preservation Hall 10/01/2008 08:03:26
No. 26:- The report mentions three buildings being damaged by the storm. I only know one, Waverley Station, but I would hazard a guess that the landmark hotel in Glasgow and the student accommodation in Dundee are, like Waverley, not new buildings. So therefore your claim of new buildings being substandard seems unfounded. Generally buildings are damaged because of lack of maintenance.
30

The Lurgan Tiger,

10/01/2008 08:13:56
Instead of purchasing some state of the art forecasting equiprment, wouldn't it be more prudent to invest in some infrastructure such as flood prevention schemes?

Just a thought
31

Unimpressed one,

10/01/2008 08:14:07
#12, Guga II, "What have these so-called meteorologists been smoking?" They've all had a whiff of the gravy train that is 'dangerous climate change". My son who is a student at Edinburgh, tells me that the science lot spend most of their time chasing research grant money. If they link their research to GW they stand a much higher chance of securing funding. Practically none of them believe in it but one does as one needs.
32

SS,

10/01/2008 08:15:12
What utter rubbish!

We live on an island in the North Atlantic 55 or 56 degrees north of the equator, the climate of which is heavily influenced by the Atlantic and Gulf Stream. Of course we will get wet and windy weather in January. What do you expect - warm and sunny?

I remember the articles last January when it was a tad milder than usual. "Are we heading for the hottest year on record?", "Drought predicted", then the summer was wetter and colder than normal.

The media's increasingly sensationalist and hysterical approcah to the weather, largely led by the BBC, is becoming unbearable. It won't be too long before we see headlines such as "Stay indoors, severely light winds and dangerously mild drizzle set to lash Scotland"...
33

Rulesbutnotrulers,

Federation, not separation 10/01/2008 08:31:17
All those useless bridges! We need a Forth causeway. That provides proof against fire, terrorism, wind closures, sea surges and rising levels, carries all forms of land transport and is by far the cheapest option. The tunnel option does few if any of these.
34

Jambo Dave,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 08:33:29
The new lightweight alloy roofs do not seem to bet fit for purpose.Evry time we have a mild breeze we see pictures of new buildings with there roofs torn off.
35

Dancer,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 08:38:43
#16
Well at least we have something to look at and not miles of endless wilderness with no rain fall and at least in Scotland we are not gun obsessed crazies. Remember the Alamo.
36

JimC,

Kilmarnock 10/01/2008 08:52:15
This green thing is getting out of hand. And this sensationalist story is second rate, for one it seems the Scotsman's geography is lacking, the river Clyde as you call it is actually the Firth of Clyde between Skelmorlie and Largs a road that for half a century has flooded, been closed washed away in parts etc. etc. The pathetic sea wall that the scotsman states is nothing more than a three foot metal fence or a short stone wall. Locals have been calling for better defences for years. As for ferry services and bridge closures these again have been happening on and off year after year for as long as I can remember. O and what about a campaign to change that decision for a new bridge and make it a tunnel instead if climate change means more severe weather in years to come. The reality is that American, India and China are showing two fingers to the rest of the world so anything we do is undermined by those three countries. I can just picture the Scotsman's editor standing by the (river clyde) saying “Go back” as the tides of the sea lap around his feet.
37

Farmernot,

oan ma traictor 10/01/2008 08:52:26
Its January.......its wet windy and cauld.......just as it should be for goodness sake........so a few lorries get blown over (news ???) and a few trees are felled ( 1987 !!!!!).........Hootsman its news we want not the namby state
38

Ichthyos,

Hamilton 10/01/2008 08:52:44
#14
I quite agree. But it would seem that the 90% coverage by the weather radar system in England did them no good in recent times.

Do you think low depression have evolved to the point they have the ability to avoid high intensity radar? Or could it be that it just does not work? Or is it that by the time it shows up on the radar it has arrived and too late to do anything about? And what would have been done differenly to avoid loss of power; bridge closures; ferry cancellations; public warnings?

No doubt the impending cyclones will not be the only things to 'spin' until more of our money is wasted.

How much are chicken-entrails anyway?
39

Media 1,

cape town 10/01/2008 08:55:39
Future Weather Reports

Due to global warming, Scotland will be cold tomorrow, wet and probably windy!
Houses in low lying areas maybe experience flooding, whilst houses in high lying areas will not.
Folk who use bridges that are only 2 metres above the average water level, may be washed away. But people who use bridges which are 50 to 100 and above metres above the general water level will be safe.
Snow fall is possible, and rising sea levels are imminent becuase the polar ice caps are melting for the first time in the history of the earth..(Oops, sorry, for the 200th that is)
You have to laugh at these global warming nutters! What a bunch of easily misled freaks they are
40

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 10/01/2008 08:58:29
Where is the evidence that our weather is getting more extreme? I have seen none.
41

an interested party,

10/01/2008 09:00:48
29
i was referring to the newly completed school with its roof hanging off, but you are correct that it is maintenance (or lack there of) that is a key factor.

why for example to we still insist on pylons to carry power, ever year they blow over and every year some are left without power becuase of it, clearly pylons are cheaper than laying the cables and we the public and left to soak it up.
42

Gothic Rose,

10/01/2008 09:11:18
Topic of lively conversation=The Weather. How Very British.
43

Johnny M,

quimland 10/01/2008 09:13:08
I love the way cold snowy weather is cited as evidence of "Climate Change" (i.e. GLOBAL WARMING)
44

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 09:24:37
Good to see all you ostriches in good form as usual. Duh - yes, we have always had mince weather in Scotland (what possessed our far ancestors to migrate to this part of the world in the first place anyway??).
The point is not that we get big storms or heavy rain in this part of the world, or droughts in SE England or hurricanes in the Carrib., but that these extreme events are becoming more common and more severe.
Anyway ostriches, I'm glad we have all you internet experts here and don't have to listen to all those nasty, silly scientists who are all in on the G.W. conspiracy just so they can get their new forecasting facilities. What villians - mwaaaahhhh hahahahahahha! (evil scientist type laugh ;->)
45

Miss H,

10/01/2008 09:31:28
It seems many of the people scoffing are no longer living in Scotland. If you were, you would be aware that the weather is indeed changing. We do not need meteorologists to tell us that, but it is obviously useful to get a professional insight.

It is strange however that this article does not touch on the financial implications of climate change. It is going to cost an immense amount of money to upgrade our transport and other infrastructure to cope with changed conditions. And what about housing? How many homes are STILL being built on flood plains, or what will become flood plains? This has to stop.

The time for committee inquiries is past, frankly, it is time for action.
46

Miss Jean Brodie,

10/01/2008 09:32:18
Hmmmm? Hey! Let’s see now - build a NEW bridge over the Forth - cause if there are bad weather conditions and they won’t have to close it to traffic - where as you would have to close a tunnel - eh? Let me see have I got this the right way roond ? Doh!
47

Miss Jean Brodie,

10/01/2008 09:33:19
Climate change - who cares - if the human race becomes extinct the planet will be a better place for it !
48

Evan Owen,

Snowdonia 10/01/2008 09:33:31
My weather predictions:

It's gonna rain, it's gonna shine, it's gonna be windy.

Very similar to the weather 11,000 years ago.


49

Isonomia,

Lenzie 10/01/2008 09:36:45
I read somewhere that 2007 was the coldest year globally since 2001. But guess what the met office "spin doctors" told the press: "2007 was the hottest year in the UK - which proves global warming".

So there we have it, the warm weather in the UK is heating up the global.

A bit like their "spin" on warming: "warming is a disaster" ... except it'll cut our heating bills, make the winter far more pleasant and stop all that hassle with having snow.

But like all pseudo-religious clap-trap everyone is doomed .... so the gulf stream will switch off!

Except the Gulf stream is warm water coming out of the Gulf of Mexico (hence its name) and it is driver by equatorial winds squeezing the warm water out and the only thing that will stop those equatorial winds is if the world stops turning.

.... And of course soon we will be told that global warming is slowing the earth down and that Scotland is going to end up on the cold side of the earth.

.... right!
50

Nell,

The Preservation Hall 10/01/2008 09:37:05
No. 41:- I've re-read the article and cant find the reference to the school with the roof blown off. I guess you are right, it's all down to economics with the pylons. It would be much more expensive to put cables under the ground and maintenance would be more costly. But lots of other things could be improved for the general public if more money was spent on them, e.g. Health Service, roads, Education etc. etc.
51

sceptic,

10/01/2008 09:45:50
We can expect a lot more snow storms as the planet warms up. Did I get that right?
52

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 09:47:23
#49 Isonomia - and what aspect of climatology or meteorology did your doctorate thesis focus on? Probably the same aspect that all these other 'experts' studied - namely internetexpertology..
Why do you think Govts. throughout the world - even the US govt - now accept that GW is real? The UN? Every major scientific institution studying this phenomenon? The Royal Society? Oh, I forgot they are all either idiots or are part of some monstrous conspiracy trying to fool us all, and you guys all know better. Well thanks for illuminating my deluded little world with your shining insight - I wonder why our so-called scientists haven't thought about all these brilliant points! :-<
53

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 09:51:14
#51 - Actually, it depends where you are. At high latitudes, warmer global temperatures (leading to more moisture in the air) DOES mean more winter snowfall - eg in the Antarctic we are seeing this and glaciers growing inland.
Here, though, it just means more rain :-(
54

sceptic,

10/01/2008 09:57:00
#49 Isonomia
"so the gulf stream will switch off!"
Don't worry the self proclaimed "world class scientists" at the "The National Oceanography Centre, Southampton, a joint venture between the University of Southampton and the Natural Environment Research Council (NERC)" have reluctantly admitted they got that wrong. They based that claim on a piece of research that would have failed "O" level physics in its rigour. Of course they now say that it needs more research, for that read more funding.

55

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 09:58:51
"METEOROLOGISTS last night said Scots will need to learn to live with the extreme weather and the chaos it has brought to the country over the past few days, as the unpredictable effects of climate change begin to bite."

What a load of absolute rubbish and lies. How do they get away with it? Why are people gullible enough to take it in?

Last year was an exceptionally mild winter. This winter is more like normal. Where exactly is the problem?

It is a sad reflection on this country that every time the weather deviates from cool and damp we have problems. When it snows, everyone crashes because they can't drive properly. When it's icy, pipes burst because people are too stupid to think ahead beyond the next edition of "East Enders". When it's hot people get sunstroke, heat exhaustion and sunburn---once again because they are stupid.

I don't know about climate change---how about "intellect change"? that would certainly explain the reasons why people not only listen to this rubbish, but some of them actually believe it too.
56

Jambo-ree,

10/01/2008 10:01:05
#49 - You're being a wee bit simplistic there my friend. The danger to the Gulf Stream (more correctly the North Atlantic Drift) is that it basically is a conveyor belt with deep currents of cooled water running in the opposite direction to replenish the warmer water heading towards us. With global warming, ice caps will continue to melt releasing vast quantities of fresh water and changing the salinity of the sea and this in turn could prevent the 'conveyor' belt effect. Result - Gulf Stream/North Atlantic drift stops and we end up with the same climate as our latitudes have on the other side of the Atlantic i.e. Newfoundland. And that is scary.
57

Freddie Moran,

Largs 10/01/2008 10:02:58
One bad storm in a year, what are we talking about. Last one was Dec 31 2006. Normally its more like two or three. Would also be interesting to see where the electricity needed to keep Scotland going yesterday came from, and if 97% of it was non nuclear generated.
58

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 10/01/2008 10:04:50
#52 For every expert crying out about GW there's another putting down the theories. The facts speak for themselves nobody has noticed any particular change in the weather patterns, winters are still cold and miserable summers are still relatively warm but yet still miserable with the occasional proper sunny day. The fact is the GW myth is another global economy money making scam which has people like you fooled.
59

Thunderstruck,

10/01/2008 10:13:08
Spin, spin and more spin.

We have had one, repeat ONE, big gale since the last equinox blew through so cue warnings of "more frequent" severe weather events.

Perhaps our "experts" can enlighten us on what caused enormous amounts of damage in January 1968 and explain why engineers have, thankfully, the foresight to design to survive "50 or 100 year storms".

We can only hope that these experts are not too big a drain on the public purse.
60

Alexander,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:20:41
#54
You might have mentioned that was a "peer reviewed" paper submitted to and approved by the IPCC. Since the conclusions were based on current flow data taken at different times of the year at various points in the Atlantic and they assumed the flow to be constant throughout the year one wonders if they fell into the traditional trap of deciding on the result before examining the data.
61

Prof,

10/01/2008 10:21:37
Yet another extremely feeble attempt by the Hootsman and the green brigade to push global warming. What next -"we can all relax as the world is flat and the water will run off the edges into oblivion". A bit like this article!
62

Patrick/Edinburgh,

Here and There 10/01/2008 10:22:05
This headline should be posted at the border, at the airport, in the hospital delivery room, at the real estate office, down at the docks and at the shoe and boot store. "Welcome to Scotland" But lets not joke about the reality, harsh weather is harsh weather, and we are only people. We do want to help one another.

I don't gather any scientific reality with the golbal warming, if we didnt warm the earth we would die as a species, cause we would freeze to death. What are we supposed to do just stop living! Always the political movement. Must be nice not to have a real job. Oh yes. " We are doing what we love and everybody else is spoiling our fun."
63

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:29:30
#58 - Unfortunately, there IS a very large consensus amongst climatologists. In a recent IPCC survey, over 95% of those currently researching in the field believe that it is 'almost certain' or 'extremely likely' that GW is real and man made.
While a consensus is not proof, the evidence is increasing year by year. We ALL hope they are wrong, but it's becoming increasingly unlikely...
64

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 10/01/2008 10:34:24
Holy jeez! Gales in January? I recall much worse about 10 years ago when the caravan we had at that time practically took off from the drive. "Experts" and especially politicians should be made aware that seasonal variations in weather are, in fact, err, seasonal. But I'm sure they know this anyway it's just another excuse to get the head in the trough for GW tax and research grants! Easy money.
65

Horrible Cankers..dans le Cyber Shebeen,

10/01/2008 10:35:23
So they Great Eastern Hotel had its roof partially blown off?.......when this building was a homeless men's hostel the top floor was shut off because of the damaged and leaking roof...for years...the Great Eastern CLOSED in 2001 so this roof has remained rotting since then....anyone care to comment on this from those who acquired the building...Milnkbank Housing Association?....why is it being left to rot?...and if anyone had been killed by falling/flying masonary would you have been responsible?....come to think of it, who actually own that building?
66

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:36:39
#60 - The authors DID note in the paper that observed changes are 'uncomfortably close' to uncertainties in measurements. The hysteria over this HYPOTHESIS was crerated by the media. Hypothesis are there to be tested and proved, or in this case possibly disproved. Talking of hypothesis, I have yet to see any ideas from the skeptics giving a possible alternative to the observed increase in global temperatures, when solar activity data shows that we should currently be seeing a decrease. As with 'scientific creationists' the climate change skeptics pick false holes in the opposing theories while absolutely failing to come uo with even a shred of a theory that will stand up to and kind of close scrutiny...
67

hud of sleat,

yorkshire 10/01/2008 10:37:23
People in Scotland have my sympathy, but the weather is as it is and you did choice to live or stay in Scotland. If you don’t like it because of the weather, why not move else where. I will gladly change houses with you.
68

Expatgirl,

10/01/2008 10:37:28
This is a lot of hype put out by the environmental industry which is spinning out of control. The occasional storm is nothing new. I remember storms like this from the 70's and 80's - garden sheds blown over, the Erskine Bridge closed. There was a huge one in England where Sevenoaks lost some of their historic trees.
I'm not sure how much I trust the news from a paper who doesn't know the difference between "careened" and "careered." Career is a noun and can't have a past tense!!
69

fred bloggs,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:37:37
One of the world's largest insurers warned of the economic costs of global warming.

"Climate change will significantly affect the health of humans and ecosystems and these impacts will have economic consequences," concludes a new study cosponsored by Swiss Re, a global re-insurance company
70

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:38:57
#64 - WOW! Seasonal variations!! I wonder why they didn't spot that!
71

fred bloggs,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:39:48
Premiums are having to be increased across Europe to cope with the number and frequency of extreme weather events, and some parts were becoming uninsurable because of repeated flooding.

Thomas Loster, of Munich Re, one of the world's largest reinsurance companies, said householders in lower risk areas might soon be faced with having to pay a €500 (£350) excess to get insurance for extreme weather events.

72

Mixu Paatelainen,

In the hotseat at ER 10/01/2008 10:43:18
You utter muppet.

This is Scotland and it is winter - get a grip of yourself. Stop trying to spin every bloody insignificant turn of weather into a global warming scare story. Long term forecasts predicted this weather in late autumn.

Don't journalist undertake research before their sausage fingers are allowed near a keyboard any more.

Pathetic.
73

Harbinger,

Land of my turbines 10/01/2008 10:44:07
I knew there was commonsense out there, great responses

They've found the guy responsible for this bad weather: "Professor John Mitchell, the Met Office's director of climate change, said the rain would become more intense, which can cause flash flooding."

At least that what his computer model came up with, but if he's directing it, he should go for something a bit more gentle.

#47 Miss Jean Brodie, go ahead, volunteer.
74

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:44:58
#68 - Language is flexible and evolves, so 'career' can have many tenses as it likes!
Can't people get it through their heads that yes, storms HAVE always happened (duh!) but we are talking about an increasing FREQUENCY and SEVERITY. Sea temperatures ARE increasing, and storms get their energy from - guess where - the seas. The sea temperature ALSO determines how much water is in the atmosphere and hence how much rain falls. So, when we DO get these storms, the average rainfall and wind strength is increasing, and will more than likely CONTINUE to increase. GW doesn't mean that the severity of ANY particular storm can be blamed on human activities, but that overall, we ARE having and impact. Humans DON'T influence the weather. We DO influence the climate.
75

morris,

edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:46:43
2

Exactly!WELL SAID .

I recall every winter for years a road running from Cake Bridge(They wont allow a male chicken apprarently) to Tomintoul was closed by snow.I was amazed to see a snowplow there in the Summer ! A local explained you have to bring it up in the summer! Its too snowy for it to climb up in the winter!They apparently run it down the hill,and thats it! If it snows again its helipcopters!

At the Lecht the road looks like a giant slalom with huge poles marking the road,so they can find it in winter! We are well used to Scotlands climate,WE LIVE HERE !
76

Jock ex 45Cdo RM,

THORNHILL 10/01/2008 10:47:27
Five high sided empty lorries blew over ?
On the M74 yesterday afternoon, a 'new' sign, HGV Lorries speed limit 30MPH due to high winds.
Did any HGV Drivers take note, no-one!!
77

Alexander,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 10:51:48
#66
The "world class experts" found that the flow had decreased by 35% over the period of their observations. That was not a hypothesis that was a conclusion reached by making a totally unjustified, scientifically naive, assumption. As usual you want to blame the messenger "was crerated by the media". The "green brigade" in their usual manner extrapolated the dubious findings to tell us that Scotland could become an icy waste within, if I recall rightly, "7 to 10 years"
78

Iain's,

10/01/2008 10:58:36
DONT PANIC!

The 'Forestry' is going to cut down all its trees so that the trees don't fall on anyone or anything. Trees are obviously a serious Health & Safety risk.

I always believed that 80 mph winds were normal, even in Edinburgh. My Dad was always putting slates back!

79

Vlad Tepes,

Snagov 10/01/2008 10:59:58
Insomnia (49)- get some sleep.
1. Despite what "you saw somewhere" Prof. Phil Jones, Director of the Climatic Research Unit, University of East Anglia, opines that "The fact that 2008 is forecast to be cooler than any of the last seven years (and that 2007 did not break the record warmth set on 1998) does not mean that global warming has gone away. What matters is the underlying rate of warming - the period 2001-2007 with an average of 0.44 °C above the 1961-90 average was 0.21 °C warmer than corresponding values for the period 1991-2000."
2. The Gulf Stream is part of the Global Oceanic Conveyer driven by thermo-haline factors- not wind. Basically cold water at the poles drives this mechanism; if the water is not sufficiently cold it breaks down. If this "large scale discontinuity" occurs the oceans die. However this scenario remains unlikely in the near future. Thanks for posting though...
80

Nikostratos,

10/01/2008 11:22:50
Well you can blame the snp for the continuing bad weather it is the Luddite attitude towards nuclear energy which will create more greenhouse gases. If we went down the nuclear path like France there would be less of a carbon footprint and we could do something to reverse this extreme weather.

81

SW,

P&K 10/01/2008 11:27:54
So, if GW continues London will be drowned by the sea. If we stop CO2 then the earth cools and Scotland gets covered in 3Km of Ice!

Off to put the central heating on......

82

Unimpressed one,

10/01/2008 11:32:41
Remember the 1968 hurricane we had in central Scotland? No talk then of 'climate chaos'. The exceptionally cold winters of 1947/1963? No met office 'experts' then telling us to get used to it because we caused it. Scots are used to moaning about the weather. Seems that now we can revert back to pagan times and 'do' something by offsetting our carbon sins. What a load of sh*te!
83

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 11:37:34
#77 - It was made clear that the results could easily be the result of natural variation - and subsequent research showed this. The media do like a good drama!
A decent summary of the possible effects of GW on the North Atlantic circulation can be found here - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shutdown_of_thermohaline_circulation
84

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 11:41:28
#82 -
I give up - it's like trying to talk to a brick wall here!
Yes, this storm can't be blamed on GW, yes we have always had storms, but also YES - GW is causing the climate to change. If the media misreport this, blame them, not the meteorologists or climatologists who would never say 'that storm was caused by global warming'. It's the muppets who misrepresent them or misread the article (like 90% of the writers here) who cause the problems.
85

PJ,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 11:42:16
People seem to have forgotten Scotland was battered by hurricane-force winds gusting as strong as 120 miles per hour back in 2002, or Wind speeds of 124 mph which were recorded in the Western Isles in 2005.

How about the winter of 1989-1990 which was one of the stormiest winters on record. One of the peak periods of stormy weather during this winter occurred during the last third of January and more specifically on 25th January, Burns' Day. A wee bit of wind and everyone panics, it's weather get on with it!!
86

Captain Flint,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 11:42:18
It's official: Scotsman readers know more about the weather than meteorologists. Go figure.

Is there anyone out there (meteorologist or layperson) who believes that Scotland gets as much snow nowadays as we did thirty years ago? Anyone at all?
87

Jambo-ree,

10/01/2008 11:43:50
#82 - No-one is saying things have not been conditions as bad in the past. What we ARE being warned about is that the incidence of these is likely to increase.
88

hud of sleat,

yorkshire 10/01/2008 11:45:01
Gentlemen! Gentlemen! Please.

Nature is nature and you can't change that. Can you.

Why all this back stabbing. Mind you. It is fun reading some of your comments.

Keep it up.
89

an interested party,

10/01/2008 11:47:59
wither global warming is real or not, we should build structures to withstand the extremes of weather we currently face, previously it has been cheaper to risk it and under engineer and just soak up the costs after the fact.

the ferocity of events hasn't increased but there regularity has, so a patch it up mentality wont do any more.

and on a completely different note, when the media defines the extend of the damage as a £ figure and proclaims 'most expensive ever' they seem to use cooncil rates and thus the price could (should) be 1/2 that
90

Flash67,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 11:52:28
86 and 87 - Far too sensible comments to be on this discussion. Can't you rant sensibly like all the others? ;->
91

Sqidward,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 12:01:11
The question is, how this is going to affect our annual date crop?
92

Tapacooma,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 12:02:24
I wonder how much power was generated from the multitude of wind farms over the last 48 hours?
93

Lock,

10/01/2008 12:07:19
#92,

Probably none. Far too windy to have them switched on.
94

Alexander,

Edinburgh 10/01/2008 12:08:12
#92
Very little is the answer. It was the wrong kind of wind,it was blowing too strongly requiring the turbines to be closed down.
95

suggsy,

edinburgh 10/01/2008 12:08:18
90 (hence 86 & 87): spot on.

The meteorologists know what they're talking about. The science is well established (childish grant-chasing myths - get a grip, please; I remember these playground rumours from the 1970s).

The experts are saying the *one* mechanism for extreme weather events is climate change: they are *not* saying there are no other mechanisms, nor that there have be