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Outgunned and out of Wimbledon

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Published Date: 04 July 2009
HE RAISED a nation's hopes that its long wait for tennis glory was over – and that Britain could finally shrug off its nearly-man status at Wimbledon.
Yet Andy Murray last night had to settle for the shattering disappointment of falling at the penultimate hurdle that the man he is determined to surpass – Tim Henman – knew too well.

In his quest to claim Britain's first place in a men's singles final since 1938, Murray was outplayed by America's Andy Roddick, going down three sets to one in a dramatic Centre Court encounter. The British No 1, third seed in the tournament, was beaten 6-4 4-6 7-6 (9-7) 7-6 (7-5) by his big-serving opponent, who goes on to face five-times champion Roger Federer in tomorrow's final.

Murray, from Dunblane, put his legions of fans at Wimbledon and watching on TV screens all over the UK through the wringer in the third and fourth sets, losing both narrowly on tie-breaks.

The 26-year-old American dropped to his knees as he won the match before appearing to mouth "I'm sorry" to the crowd.

Murray said afterwards: "You always expect your opponents to play well at this stage of the tournament. I had a few chances in the first tie-break and chances early in the third set and I didn't take them. I thought I played well."

Murray's mother, Judy, and girlfriend, Kim Sears, had watched intently from their usual seats in the players' box, alongside his four-man coaching team. Murray's father, Willie, was also there to lend support.

After watching Murray slip to defeat, Henman – who suffered four semi-final losses – warned him it would take a long time to leave the defeat behind. But he added: "I don't think it will alter his view or certainly my view that he will win here one day."

In the star's home town, where shops, pubs, cafes and sports clubs were decked with banners, the butcher's shop was selling "Murray burgers", the Dunblane Hotel was serving strawberries, and fans packed into the bowling club, dejection replaced Murraymania last night .

But David McFarlane, 60, a family friend of the Murrays, said: "I am disappointed but I'm happy he made a semi-final. He has plenty of time left to take the Wimbledon title.

"I have so much respect for him because he has done a fantastic job. It makes me so proud. All he has to do now is come back next year better and stronger and he will win."

Health visitor Christina MacCallum, 35, was "really proud" of what Murray has achieved. She said: "He's done so well. At 22, hopefully he will do it again next year. But we're proud he got this far in Wimbledon anyway. He lost to a really good contestant and he's done really well. I feel 2010 will definitely be his year."

Stirling's provost, Fergus Wood, said: "He is a terrific ambassador for the outstanding sporting facilities here and there are certainly big things to come, not just from the Murray family but other youngsters too.

"Obviously we are enjoying being in the spotlight but we have enjoyed this kind of attention before with Braveheart. Andy certainly has that Braveheart factor."

First Minister Alex Salmond said: "Andy has made Scotland proud by having such a magnificent championship.

"He has enormous talent and is a genuine contender to win any Grand Slam – I'm sure he will have many successes.

"It's wonderful for Scotland to have such a prodigious tennis talent as it encourages children from all over the country to participate in the sport, and Andy is a tremendous inspiration."

Scottish Secretary Jim Murphy said: "Andy Murray's magic did us proud and he put up a great fight. He is a player with a huge amount of talent and with great prospects before him and I'm sure he will win Wimbledon one day."

PAIN FOR NAMES

THE disappointment of Andy Murray's semi-final defeat was felt by a clutch of tennis legends, members of the Royal Family and a string of big-name celebrities.

Bjorn Borg, Rod Laver, Ilie Nastase, Guillermo Vilas and Mansour Bahrami were among the former Centre Court idols to watch the action unfold.

Celebrity watchers spotted Doctor Who star David Tennant, a fellow Scot, Dame Maggie Smith, Sir Michael Parkinson and Sir David Frost among the crowd yesterday.

The Duke and Duchess of Kent, the Duke of York, Princess Alexandra, the Duchess of Gloucester, the Earl of Ulster and Viscount Linley were among those in the Royal Box.

Murray revealed just before his clash with Andy Roddick that football icon David Beckham was his latest big-name fan.

The Scot took time out from preparing for his Centre Court showdown to reveal on his Twitter site that Beckham had sent him a good-luck message.

Murray said: "Had a hit, back in lockers. Good luck message from David Beckham last night. Thanks!" Murray had already won the backing of the Queen, Kate Winslet, Sir Sean Connery and Sir Cliff Richard.

BOOKIES' RELIEF

BRITAIN'S bookies breathed a sigh of relief last night after avoiding pay-outs of up to £10 million if Andy Murray had won the Wimbledon title.

More money had been placed on the Scot than any other in the tournament's history.

Ladbrokes spokesman David Williams said: "It was the biggest anti-climax of the betting year.

"Loyal fans are in disbelief and we've escaped what would've been our biggest payout in tennis betting history.

"Tim Henman cost British punters more cash than any other sportsman but Murray might just have pinched that unwelcome title in the past few weeks.

"Murray mania is over and we've lived to tell the tale, but we suspect he'll be back to give us more sleepless nights."

Graham Sharpe, a spokesman for William Hill, added: "If Murray had won we would have been paying out more than we ever have before on any individual at a tennis tournament – total payout would have been approaching £10 million."

Any Murray fans keen to show their support for their hero can gets odds of 5/2 for him to win Wimbledon next year, and 7/1 to scoop this year's BBC Sports Personality of the Year award.


Page 1 of 1

 
1

Blue Tooner,

04/07/2009 00:47:31
Thanks Andy for a couple of great weeks sport! Next year mate, next year!
2

Cabbie,

Edinburgh 04/07/2009 00:52:55
Andy Murray will be gutted but he didn't play badly. Andy Roddick just played better on the day.
3

Fitba Krazy,

04/07/2009 00:57:02
Andy Murray couldn't have been beaten by a closer margin.

Just a few points in it in tie-breakers.

I don't think he has yet reached his peak at only 22 and has done absolutely brilliantly against more experienced players.

4

BROONISDOOMED,

PITS OF HELL 04/07/2009 01:27:03
and the gloating by english people,on yahoo sports was disgusting,andy go win it next year,then tell them you wont be back playing at wimbledon
for his age i think hes a better player than tim henman was
but henman did stick up for andy on the bbc,just wish his fellow country men did the same,and to think they say we are racists to english people
go anywhere in the world,when they find out your scottish your made welcome
but not if your english
wonder what its like to be 1 of the most hated races in the world
5

Fifi la Bonbon,

04/07/2009 02:26:28
#4 - the Scottish are better than the English so they are. nicer people with better table manners. when Scotland gets its freedom we will ban that yahoo sports, a nest of vipers so it is. and we will have our own tennis championship and the English will be banned. see how they like that. Ha ha.
6

!Ya basta!,

04/07/2009 03:40:37
4 and 5 - you sound like very bad losers. Most of Scotland gloats when England loses anything so let's not be too smart about ourselves eh?

Its very disappointing Murray lost because this was a huge chance. Roddick played very well for sure but I didn't understand Murray's tactics. He seemed to try and out gun Roddick most of the time but he has such a wide repertoire of shots I don't know why he didn't try mixing it up more.

Anyway, it's over now and we have a poorer final which Federer will walk but all credit to Roddick who is such a nice guy and deserves some kind of chance.

7

Astarte,

Giffnock 04/07/2009 04:21:25
#4 Broonisdoomed and #5 Fifi la Bonbon your lacking propensity for sport is openly misplaced in an arena of fairplay. When objectivity is absent in a narrow mind then embarrassment is spread amongst us and we must work hard to recover. Andy Murray is a Tennis player and a Scotsman, he is not a Tennis player representing Scotland. Wimbledon is not about Nations meeting other Nations in a Tennis contest, it is about the Worlds Professional Tennis players competing for money and glory and I can't make it any simpler than that for you. I travel in many countries as the representative of a Scottish based International conglomerate with Head Offices in London, that's how the world revolves today in a Global atmosphere and the names of Scotland and England are autonomous only on the pages of a World Atlas.
8

therevd,

Vientiane 04/07/2009 05:44:28
"the names of Scotland and England are autonomous only on the pages of a World Atlas"(7). Absolutely: the Thai word for Britain is "Angrit". Here, it is "Angit". What does this mean? Well on my local driving license, the country of my birth is "England". Does this mean that having met with little success in Scotland for so many years, my home team of Montrose FC, can have a pop at the FA Cup? I've tried to point out it should be UK, if they're referring to more than just England. This resulted in my nationality being recorded as Ukrainian!
It might sound trivial but Andy Murray and other high profile people, pointing out that they are not English, but Scottish, does help when it comes to explaining the popular misconception that England is an independent nation.
9

Aldi Shopper,

Irvine 04/07/2009 06:24:35
All this over a boy who hits a ball over a net and is paid a fortune for it while others struggle in the real world.
10

,

04/07/2009 06:34:47
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
11

Bob Corfield,

Jamberoo 04/07/2009 06:43:29
Ah, what I think this means #8 is that the sooner Scotland gets its independence the sooner you will clear up any confusion about your nationality and that of every other Scot!

302 years servitude is long enough.

I hope the noted increased number of Scottish kids out on the tennis courts today who are saying "I can do what Andy's doin!" will help minimise any disappointment most of Scotland might feel today.

Not yet Andy, but soon!
12

Boy Wonder,

04/07/2009 06:46:30
I didn't expect Andy to get through to the Final this year. But next year should be a totally different matter. Chalk it down to him needing the experience! He's still the best hope we've had in Tennis for decades.
13

Corrennie,

04/07/2009 06:48:00
## 4 & 5##

Didn't take long for the whingeing chippy Scots to come out from under their stones, did it?

'We wuz robbed' etc, etc. Usual defeatist attitude.

All part of the great English conspiracy against the poor, downtrodden Scots.

It's only a tennis match. Get over it.
14

Rabhairt,

Australia 04/07/2009 06:49:53
GOODONYER ANDY MATE, A GREAT EFFORT AND YOU DID YOUR BEST ON THE DAY, WITH A LITTLE BIT MORE LUCK IT COULD HAVE BEEN YOURS BUT IT IS NOT THE BE ALL AND END ALL OF YOUR CAREER AND THERES PLENTY MORE OPPORTUNITIES GOING TO COME YOUR WAY WHICH YOU REALLY DESERVE, KEEP ON KEEPING MATE.
15

Navvy,

singapore 04/07/2009 06:59:22
#7
Just so, I agree and yesy Andy Roddick has a Scots name too and thier looks are no that different, the winner seemed a nice, polite and modest lad.

Wimbledon is great tennis and great sport but Scotland does not need a population seeking to live in the reflected glory of a few heros. It needs a population which gets out and does for itself
16

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 07:09:30
5 Fifa la BonBon-absolutely the best post for a long time and to think some of the punters here actually didn't getit made it doubly funny :):):):)
17

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 07:10:51
Oh and by the way-well done Andy! Tim henman is right-you will win wimbledon one day and make Scotland and Britain and Europe proud!
18

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 04/07/2009 07:34:31
Having watched Wimbledon on BBC TV and never once heard a commentator refer to Andy Murray as Scots, it was sad to note that Andy Murray was called a Scotsman for the first time just after 6pm on Friday when he was two sets to one down.
19

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 07:46:05
19 Auld Twa-the Telegraph refers to him in defeat as British generally and from memory I dont think Henman was ever called anything other than British. Do you HONESTLY believe that there is some kind of conspiracy in this Scots -British labelling whereby the English disown the Scots in defeat?
20

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 08:05:17
Considering the English for the most part supported Andy Murray, it has not stopped some Scottish barmpots from trying to advance their own biggoted agenda's.

At what point did we deserve to be called racists, the worlds No 1 hated race, and unwelcome around the world , re: post no 4 ?

Geoff, Auld Twa posted the same comment last night, he is playing to the cheap seats in the gallery, marked victim, his ramblings are best ignored.

Good post Fifi.
21

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 04/07/2009 08:05:39
#19 Geoff.
Just an observation, he had been referred to as "Murray" all week and that was the first time we'd heard him called "the Scotsman".
22

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 08:22:17
Murray has beaten every ranking player at some stage or other.He will do so again. The gap between Murray and the current no1 cannot be a big gap since he has already beaten everybody !

Those who gloat just show their own inadequacy and we should ask them
"As an outsider, what do you think of the human race"?
This will encourage AM to fly the Saltire even more now (something which he does not need a lot of encouraging to do apparently).

I like to think that he is saving his best for an independent Scotland.
He can then not only fly the Saltire upon his victory.
British exists only in the sense that some people wish to have a common identity,but they are of course Scots,English,Northern Irish and Welsh .

There are debatably many British people in existence, and I have observed both people who wish to be and just as many who do not.
Whilst I agree that the individual should always decide for themselves,increasingly the Scots are seeing one identity only.


I was slightly amused by Radio Scotland's reference to him as Tim Murray this morning.
I don't think he is a Rangers fan so what excuse does that leave?
23

Helen,

04/07/2009 08:37:12
Broonisdoomed #4 - I am English and am certainly not remotely bothered what you think of me. Might I just point out that the word 'your' has a significantly different meaning to 'you're'. Indeed all sentences are much more readable when capital letters and punctuation are used appropriately. However, who am I to comment, I went to an English school!!!!
I never saw Tim Henman being racist towards the Scots or wanting to wear the football shirt of whoever was playing Scotland.
24

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 08:46:22
Morris are you for real!! You Scots have made gloating a national sport, you are the world champion gloaters, you actually seem to derive more pleasure from England losing than Scotland winning !!

Why exactly do you think losing at Wimbledon will encourage Andy to fly the Saltire more ?

Are you actually suggesting that losing will make him ignore and turn his back on the English supporters who bothered to go to watch him, and make him 'more' patriotic !!! I know you are old, but you really do talk a load of old pants !

25

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 08:51:11
20

At what point did we deserve to be called racists, the worlds No 1 hated race, and unwelcome around the world , re: post no 4 ?

Difficult question that one.

It probably depends upon too many factors to even begin to be defined in time ,but the answers would vary presumably from "dont agree at all" to "when did you last invade them?
I think the comment was a bit tongue in cheek, but theres a lot of tongue in cheek people going around!

The claim will find many who will agree with it!
Personally I detest the Scots who betray Scotland,but England won the Jules Rimet TRophy in 1966 and have since referred to it (CONSTANTLY)as the World Cup, is a contender!
Its NOT the same competition,nor are England legitimate champions anyway.Under Jules Rimet rules the host nation cannot play all its games at Wembley.England did!

Does this matter? It depends upon how important you think rules are!
The current national anthem is a declaration of war against Scotland, and even Princess Anne destests it!
England would be better advised to listen to and take on board ,than refute these allegations.The last thing she should do is seek to prove it, by dismissing the opinions of others just because you can.
The question we should ask is WHY do you say that?The answers I suspect are too numerous to even contemplate.

Whether its true or not is again a matter of individual perception.
26

Machelpus,

04/07/2009 08:52:06
Blah de Blah de Blah Andy Lost so blame the English hahahah do the bigots ever read their own insular posts, Andy lost to a player who on the day was a tad and only a tad better than him, it happens to the best, As for being hated over the world another laugh that, having travelled extensively not my perspective.

One question do any of you with tunnel vision have a driving licencse cos that must be a road hazard.
27

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 08:54:14
24 I dont think losing will encourage him you dolt!I think winning will.I have little doubt that he will win in the forseeable future,and I expect Scotland to be an independent nation.That is what I said .That is what I meant.
28

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 09:01:51
24 Ps You know I am quite old?

I have read a fair bit about the ancient Greeks and Romans and Vikings and even earlier than that,but I was not actually there in person.

I think its called history.

You know sweet francis adams.
29

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 09:35:01
Nobody is blaming England for anything to do with the splendid showing (but not yet enough) to go all the way.
On the contrary in claiming him as a Scot (which he himself does) we automatically reject any involvement of England whatsoever!


There are those on here who show a tolerance level which deserves the accusations made against them, and not for the first time!
If the cap fits.
30

famous 15,

Edinburgh 04/07/2009 09:36:36
Well done Andy Murray. I am not schizophrenic so I will just say Scotland is proud of you! (It is amazing how Scots are pressured to say AND British....English people quite rightly do not diminish their aspirations thus)
31

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 09:46:55
Morris,
"Personally I detest the Scots who betray Scotland,but England won the Jules Rimet TRophy in 1966 and have since referred to it (CONSTANTLY)as the World Cup"

Moris, you speak of hatred of your fellow Scots who you feel betray Scotland, then link it to....wait for it you English posters...."66" !!
Tell me Mo, why are the Scots obsessed with Englands world cup win, you love to mention it, why is that?

I suspectd you are old because of your pompous rambling post.





32

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 10:00:45
32

I am not "obsessed" with Englands World Cup Win.If anything I am sick of hearing about it again and again.The very opposite of what you are saying.

I am quite fond of seeing film footage of Englands next game however in 1967! I could soon learn to become obsessed by that!

I suspect you are old now!

You knew it half an hour ago!
I wont accuse you of anything at all.I dont have to now! You're doing a first class job of destroying yourself.
33

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 04/07/2009 10:06:22
30 bring it on
Oh dear what a desperate and deluded rant.

Let us look at some of your assertions :

"in particular the BBC, who are bigots and despise Scots"

If that is the case why do they employ so many Scots in high profile presentation on BBC TV and radio :
Nicki Campbell, Andrew Marr, Kirsty Wark, Ken Bruce, James Naughtie, Alan Robb, Alan Hansen, Ally McCoist etc. etc.


"That same year the Scottish team won The Sports Personality of The Year and at the ceremony in London the award was praticaly flung at them"

They won the team event that year and if your description is right, why did they award it to them in the first place? And of course we all saw the award being "flung" at Chris Hoy last year which is obviously why there was such a long standing ovation.

"Two year later England were humped again"

Go back and check the result of the 1992 Calcutta Cup match.

"The English FA were instrumental in stopping the famous Scotland England football internationals because they could not stand getting beaten by Scotland."

Go and check the records and find out what the score was the last occasions this fixture was played to see if your claim has any credibility.

"after the Scots were forced to walk to Wembley from central London."

This was caused by London underground workers going on strike as a protest about staff having been assaulted on the previous occasion.

As is evident your tirade has no bsis in fact or reality. It must therefore be a mere imagined product of your particular obsession.


34

Willie Mor,

04/07/2009 10:15:03
Well done young Mr Murray.

You've been an inspiration to many many youngster and although you didn't get through to the final I am sure you will next time round.

Take heart from your performances this year and the fact that there was very little in it between yourself and Andy Roddick.

Your time will come.
35

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 04/07/2009 10:23:29
I watched the Murray Roddick game and it was one either player was capable of winning. While Murray played a good game, Roddick was more successful in making his first serves count. Roddick had a strategy and was clinical in its execution. The pressure was all on Murray and he allowed himself to be outgunned. Both players seemed to be attempting to win all their service games and hopefully pick up one other in the set, and if they did not hope to win the tiebreak. I think Murray fell into this trap which Roddick set. On the day this tactic favoured Roddick. One or too sloppy shots either way determined the outcome. It was actually very defensive play by both players and was not the most beautiful tennis I have watched. In some of his other games in the tournament Murray had difficulty converting an Advantage into a Game win, and it often returned to Deuce and his opponent took the game. Where points were essential to win, Murray did not get them whereas Roddick did. Murray will learn from this game and come back better. But his preparation for Wimbledon could not be faulted. Better luck next year.

36

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 10:24:50
34 Of course the BBC employ some Scots.It would be a clear discrimination along racial grounds if they did not.Logie Baird is the outstanding one of course!

Im pretty sure they are predominantly if not all Unionists,and I know that Andrew Marr (Dundonian) was educated at Lorreto School (where Ian Gray went) and was known as "RED ANDY "at (Trinity Hall)Cambridge.

He was once on the staff of SCOTSMAN PUBLICATIONS I think.

I do however recognise him as a gentleman and an excellent advert for Scotland and Dundee and journalism.
He never forgets his manners and unlike many does NOT try to defeat or humniliate those who do not share his views,which says a lot for his standing in his profession.

That does not excuse the BBC from being guilty on numerous scores,not least of all funding of BBC SCOTLAND.
37

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 10:30:02
Morris 32
I am not "obsessed" with Englands World Cup Win.If anything I am sick of hearing about it again and again.The very opposite of what you are saying"

Then why did you mention it in the fist place, as it was off topic anyway Mo?

Mo, you rally must learn to copy and paste, then you will not get muddled up quoting me.

I said, and I quote " I suspectd you are old because of your pompous rambling post", not, and I quote, "suspect you are old now"!

30# Bring it on independnce Now. Eh ???

Well Hallelujah to that from all Englishmen !

Have you sought professional help for your raging paranoia and persecution complex?
38

Lianachan,

Highlands 04/07/2009 10:30:03
#18 My wife and I noticed that too. Even my 10 year old son asked why Murray's British when he's winning but Scottish when he's losing.
39

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 10:31:12
Huntly Loon and willie Mor-nice clean comments.

Its amazing how every article in the Scotsman is 'spun'(hate the word but what else to use?) into an England-Scotland/Unionist-Nationalist slanging match.

Hi Morris! Or Andy Henman!! :)
40

Scunner,

Aberdeen 04/07/2009 10:39:53
Well done Andy. A great achievement getting to the semis. When was the last time a Scotsman got that far? Hopefully he will come back stronger next year. He has a great chance of winning a slam in New York later in the year.
41

Joanna,

Cambs, England 04/07/2009 10:47:05
Shame to see Andy Murray's dream end yesterday, but Andy Roddick played the better game. Tennis is like that its no good quoting stats, its how they play on the day. Which is why Roddick has a chance of beating Fed on Sunday if he plays like yesterday. Having said that I think Fed will claim his 15th Major and be declared the greatest player of all time, because he is playing exceptionally well this Wimbledon.

Andy Murray will regroup, train harder and come back stronger for the US Open. Good luck Andy and thanks for an exciting and nail-biting Wimbledon! :)

As for the English hate us because I read it on a website.... what? The whole of England were not commenting on that site... I wasn't for a start.

Aren't there any political stories about England doing you down that the cyber-nats can get their teeth into today? Tennis is tennis and men's singles are about personalities not nationalities. Think what you like but Andy Murray was representing only Andy Murray yesterday.
42

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 10:48:08
39 Lianachan-In some households the comment might be-"Why is he scottish when he's winning and british when he's losing!?":)

I have seen the headlines in English newspapers referring to him as the flying Scot or great scot and as i said,todays telegraph refers to him in general terms as a losing Brit!! I honestly think you could argue it on the facts both ways, depending on one's particular preference!
43

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 10:56:51
42 Joanna-Hi joanna how are you today? Its a chilly day in durban-probably in the low teens! Will be donning my Lions shirt and Springbok scarf for the Rugby this am-always a bit schizo when it comes to these two teams! On the subject wouldnt you like to sit down in private with the talented young murray and ask him what he(incidentally) really thinks about all this Brit-Scot stuff-not that it really matters- as you say he will be shouting for Andy Murray first and foremost!
44

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 10:58:55
39-"Why is he scottish when he's winning and british when he's losing!?"

Your ten year is already talking like a victim, you must be really proud !


45

EK,

04/07/2009 11:08:22
#9 is correct. It's just a game of tennis. The world's not going to end, and it is of no real consequence to anyone or anything. Sport should be for playing, not watching. Sportsmen, film and pop stars get paid way too much as it is - there are more deserving people in the world. So people should stop acting as if this is in any way important. Thanks for listening. Peace.
46

Lianachan,

Highlands 04/07/2009 11:09:22
#43 39 Lianachan-In some households the comment might be-"Why is he scottish when he's winning and british when he's losing!?":)

Personally, I don't care whether he's Scottish or British when competing for himself, but a bit of consistancy from the BBC would have been nice. Fair enough, call him British, but please continue to do so when he's not winning anymore.

#45 "Your ten year is already talking like a victim, you must be really proud !"

Actually, it's just that some things are extremely obvious even to a child. And, with that, I trust you're finished insulting children on the internet? It is you who must be very proud.
47

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 11:12:44
38

I am not obsessed with 1966.England is and its over 40 years ago!That is why I and many of my countrymen are sick of hearing about it and why I mentioned it.

If I copy and paste I will have the following:
I know you are old

and then

I suspectd you are old
I would have left the d out and not copied and pasted by preference.
The point is these two statements are chronologically impossible .
I am therefore correct.

Lets agree to differ.I dont see any point in pursuing this stupid debate. Agreed or must you have one final dig ?
48

Joanna,

Cambs, England 04/07/2009 11:17:31
Hi Geoff.....:)

Its been very hot here all week ... temps in the 30s, which is classed as a heatwave here. I've been working but its still nice to see the sun :)

Its a shame that Andy Murray has gone out but I think the pressure might have got to him even tho' he played it down at interview. He seemed to lose focus and his cool a couple of times which, I think, contributed to his loss. He needs to be as strong, mentally and physically as Federer and Nadal to challenge for the top place. Not quite there yet, but there's still time.

As far as the Brit-Scot stuff goes, I doubt if Andy Murray keeps himself awake at night worrying about that. He obviously relishes the applause of the home crowd at Wimbledon and does his best to engage their support. It often seemed that his opponents were playing the whole of Centre Court. Which just shows the mental strength that Andy Roddick played with yesterday.

Enjoy the rugby ... just support the winning side... that'll be the Springboks then!! :))
49

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 11:24:50
40 Hiya Geoff How goes it?

I did notice earlier by the way.

49 A very reasonable offering Joana and Im sure you are very close to being correct,if not correct.
Good Morning to you also by the way.
50

Douglas,

Bathgate 04/07/2009 11:28:55
They think it's all over.

It isn't now.
Third seed, came third, that worked out then.
The man's an athlete and a competitor and he'll be back.
We're the typing pool.
51

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 11:42:15
51 I think thats fair comment also Douglas.

He will be back for sure, and I am confident that he will win it in the next few years,and a few other ranking events along the way.
We should sit back and enjoy the ride.He is the best hope for Wimbledon we have and are likely to have for some time. Aged 22 he only knocks on the door and it will open for him soon.
Of that I have no doubt.
52

Ewen Miler,

Wilts 04/07/2009 11:42:54
#4 and #5
Sounds like you hate everything English: think that makes you rascist? The comments on Yahoo sports are similar to those I've seen posted by some Scots when England\Englishman gets beat. Ignorance breeds ignorance! Do not trade insults with ignorant people -rise above it and try to show them the error of their ways.
Shame Andy got beat. He'll b






53

Geoff,

sa 04/07/2009 11:56:35
50 morris-going well Morris-hope it is with you too!

49 Joanna-in the thirties is hot by any standards! Enjoy!

Although the Lions are two nil down they have entertained us well and can hold their heads high! I was at the durban test and for me it was lovely to see that, despite a wide range no doubt of political and national hue from all parts of the Islands of britain and ireland, this is one time when the "Brirish(my word!) social union is alive and well!
54

Ugly George,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 12:05:13
53 ewen miller
Indeed so. In my experience this type of comment is usually associated with people (wherever they are from) who lead their lives full of negative emotions such as bitterness, resentment and fabricated grievance. What a sad way to go through life.

PS
#4 was serious, #5 was taking the mickey.
55

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 12:12:36
My apologies Morris, didnt mean to upset you, I was mearly responding to your comments, maybe we should both read our posts before we send, to make sure we are not offending whole nations with preconceived predjuces.
56

danbob,

04/07/2009 12:57:51
57# Stop ranting. Ugly George is head and shoulders above you in readable and intelligent postings. Since you think Scotland are better than England at football, do you remember euro 96. 2-0 comes to mind. Oh the moment Gazza left Hendry looking skyward when the ball was heading goalbound. If that shot had been used in a spot the ball competion nobody would have guessed it.
57

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 13:20:14
Danbob, you took the words out of my mouth, I love the fact that old 'Bring it on', has so much anger, it makes him soooo easy!

He is a perfect study case of a certain type of Scot whose psyche allows him to play the vitim as well as patting themselves on the back, and are shameless about playing the old "we are a small country punching above our weight" card when all else fails, priceless.

The fact that we English dont like being labled 'British' would not cross his worried mind !

58

Lady Golightly,

04/07/2009 13:34:07
This is a tennis thread not a football one, kindly go and rant about the boring game elsewhere.

As for the inane comments about middle England not supporting Andy Murray, how ridiculous. Wimbledon is in the heart of middle England and most of Andy's supporters there during the tournament were English.

Apart from me, but I, of course am upper-class.
59

danbob,

04/07/2009 14:01:33
65# Yes mi lady. Your wish is my command. I do like a bit of class.

Shame you dont have any then isn't it.
60

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 14:31:19
65,
"63 Stats are cheils that winnae ding"

If you like stats, how about Scotland not qualitying for a world cup since 86,and never getting through the first round ever when they have.
61

Lady Golightly,

04/07/2009 14:42:26
66

Don't forget to curtsey next time you address me, peasant.
62

Chief King Bonga,

04/07/2009 15:02:49
Lady G,
I, I do believe Danbob was addressing Bring it on, not you !
63

Lady Golightly,

04/07/2009 15:19:53
"Chief King Bonga,04/07/2009 15:02:49
Lady G,
I, I do believe Danbob was addressing Bring it on, not you !"

Sorry Your Majesty, my mistake, that blighter of a butler of mine moved my reading glasses. He'll have to bring the Pimms on ice double quick for that little transgression.


64

Lady Golightly,

04/07/2009 15:21:22
Danbob you seem like a pleasant peasant.
65

danbob,

04/07/2009 16:14:00
71# Oh shut up you posh tart.
66

tbmom,

Katy Tx 04/07/2009 16:16:00
Thankyou Andy.You were just outplayed but you proved you have what it takes to go the whole way.Just keep focused and relax the championship will be yours one day,I have no doubt. You did Scotland proud.
67

Pete R ,

04/07/2009 17:01:29
#57 BIOIN

I bet you're really a sweety.
68

jane shore,

london 04/07/2009 17:37:13

BIOIN ........@75.............Scottish football fans......loverly arent they ?

Sectarian racism immediately comes to mind. Manchester loved you all last year.
69

Alfie the OK,

The English Regions!!!! 04/07/2009 18:20:29
The three great lies - reworked.

1) Can't tell you - too rude.
2) The cheque's in the post.
3) As soon as a Scotsman loses he suddenly stops being British and becomes Scots once more...

Utter rubbish of course. Murray was always described as a Scot, right through the tournament - On the BBC news, in all the papers, all over the web. 'The Scot Murray' is de rigeur as a descripto...just like 'strawberries and cream', 'Henman bottles it again' and 'rain stopped play'

Did you see GMTV on Friday morning? They were up in Dunblane - that prat Richard Wassisname was prancing around in a damned great big Saltire for most of the show. The butchers apron was nowhere to be seen.

Obviously not so for Tiger Tim. Never has Henman been described as English. Timbo is British, end of.

Being English is sort of frowned upon in Gordon Brown's world. And as the Murray-Roddick match over ran, the BBC helpfully put up a little caption telling all the people who were watching in the English Regions that if they wanted to see the news, they had to retune to BBC2. Great! I'm not from England - I'm from the English Regions.....

And as I live in an English Region, I cannot be allowed an English Parliament, an English First Minister, an English National Anthem, an English national culture or indeed any English national sporting heroes...

(And have you ever noticed that when the BBC refer to an English sporting team, they ALWAYS say 'The England football team' or 'The England cricket team'....

NEVER 'The English team'..)

People in Scotland - you have your national identity, you have your national culture, you have your national empowerment - we don't.

That's the difference.

70

The Scotchman,

04/07/2009 19:41:59
78 "People in Scotland - you have your national identity, you have your national culture, you have your national empowerment - we don't."

-
Now, whilst some above were on about 1966, which is one of the great English/Scottish things. The event was called "Jules Rimet Cup - England".

I cannot speak for the entire tournament but the British Union flag is throughout this - from the logo, the mascot, the TV studio, the crowd waving flags, etc. Union flags are all over the place. eg:

http://tinyurl.com/lc9wg4

Now we (and Gordon Brown) could not of been behind that happening? This was your occasion - no one else.
We could actually claim it was a British win here with all this stuff. We don't of course as that's silly.

So why the British thing and no English identity here? It makes no sense other than the British thing is actually the English identity.

Now it's like suddenly over the last few years, "we are actually English - not British". We see the internationals with St George cross now. It's like a new direction compared to just some years back and the establishment are unsure.
71

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 19:50:55
78 BBC broadcasts as a national feed which can be opted out of in all "regions".Scotland is classified as a region as are Wales and Northern Ireland (but underfunded as are probably all thje Regions except London.

The reason you are not classified as England is because you are numerous regions and collectively England, but you are not disadvantaged in any way apart from serious underfunding as are we.

English and British are interchangable to all intents and purposes since British invariably means predominantly English (which is fair enough since you are around 80% of the United Kingdom).I do not suggest it should be otherwise. Pro Rata is as it should be,The problem is thats NOT what happens.
Any smaller nation which enters into any arrangement with a larger one will always be the poor relation and we have no complaint here since we are not denied the right to change this(well not so far anyway).

The English Regions have never wanted assemblies.We cannot force devolution upon English regions against the will of the majority. If you ask for regional assemblies then you shall have them Im sure.

As for an English parliament, every time a particular area is devolved from Westminster,it means that Westminster deals with England only or England and Wales only etc automatically so in theory by giving Wales Scotland and Northern Ireland devolved government England also has it in these same areas.

What I would acknowledge is that Scots MPS have no business whatsoever voting upon devolved matters concerning England and you are MORE THAN JUSTIFIED in complaining about this.The answer is lets have the ultimate devolution.

Scotland and The Rest part company.
What Wales and NI do is up to them.
No one in Scotland apart from Unionists wants to deny you anything.On the contrary we would encourage you to demand a greater degree of control over your own internal affairs.

We bear England no malice whatsoever.The arrangement between Norway and Sweden (the
72

The Scotchman,

04/07/2009 19:54:35
#79 whilst the English clubs were banned from European matches; Dundee United fans - the Arabs - were the first winners of "FIFA Fair Play Award" due to their behaviour. That award was created especially for them. It never existed before. The Fair Play concept still exists today. Celtic fans also won the award in 2003 for similar behaviour.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA_Fair_Play_Award
73

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 19:56:03
81 cont

The arrangement between Norway and Sweden is a model I would gladly have copied (they are almost seamless) and we are all EU countries presumably anyway.

I can only say Good Luck and fare well.
74

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 04/07/2009 20:06:36
Hmmmm? Andy Murray lost a semi-final at Wimbledon. A grand slam.

Did he not also lose a grand slam final in America?

Yes, a final. All grand slams are worth 2000 points to the winner.

So, what's all the nationalistic guff all about?
75

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 04/07/2009 20:14:34
re 84. The Brits suffer from moist undies during Wimbledon fortnight because they ignore the other tournaments and live in a wee world of their own.

It's all media hype every year and the hysteria is very shrill and girlie.

Mature ffs and show the ATP world tour. Yes, that's WORLD tour.
76

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 04/07/2009 20:16:57
Or do you think that Murray got to be WORLD no3 purely by getting one round better at each Wimbledon?
77

Charley,

Down south at the mo. 04/07/2009 20:44:48
Oh me goodness! Morris, Independence Now et al. It amazes me how a thread on tennis can be turned into a vial bigoted rant against the English. From down here it looks very different, he is British No. 1 and a Scotsman too. You spin and create to serve your black hearts....I feel sorry for you sitting at the computer with your crisps and bru, pizza for dinner followed by a read of Railway Modeller or Tartan pants weekly. Away with ya!
78

morris,

edinburgh 04/07/2009 21:14:13
87

I actually agree that the whole thing was ridiculous, but I am not anti English. I actually live with an English girl and both my PPC and MSp are from the south.Because I disagree with certain attitudes does NOT say anything other than I disagree.

I disagree with a lot of my fellow Scots also.
I actually detest any racist view and have always wished equality amongst all men and nations.
I know that is true,and I apologise to no one for it.

YOur comments are exactly the kind of arrogance I dislike !
79

Pomodora,

Gravesend 04/07/2009 22:29:34
I have just finished reading all of the comments but please do not accuse me of lacking ambition,my mental portals are open to absurdity. My conclusion is that when it rains in Scotland it pours paranoia.
80

Lady Golightly,

04/07/2009 23:14:24
I see the BION laddie is ranting away to himself now.... perhaps a few too many tins on a hot day would explain that away. Amazing that someone who lives in a doorway can get hold of a laptop at all. Still its surprising what people put in their bins for the rakers to hunt through.
81

Annlass,

Toronto 05/07/2009 10:36:19
#72 Pomodora, paranoia is the centre-piece of the Scots psyche and they do tend to entertain us with consistency. I withdraw this appliance form Astate #7 Giffnock, wherever that place is located, who has produced a comment in sensible proportion. I also concede to some others who are not wrapped in the blue and white.
82

Charley,

back in you rope 05/07/2009 14:57:32
Lub a duck me old mucker - Independnece Now - really, please see a specialist about your problem, seriously. You must be looking at future heart problems with your pent up bigotry...Morris - you seem like an intelligent person from your response and I apologise for upsetting you. Can you advise Independence on how to become more balanced...ps. i'm from your country.
83

MattyMat,

So Cal 06/07/2009 16:56:58
Andy would have been given the task of taking on Roger-- and the Fed would have to be drunk not to beat anyone right now--...
84

Rev Ted,

10/07/2009 06:00:35
Roddick is too good.

 

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