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Brown bid to tax banks sunk by US

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Published Date: 08 November 2009
GORDON Brown yesterday faced fresh embarrassment over his handling of the economic crisis when his radical plans for a new transaction tax on banks were almost immediately shot down by Barack Obama's administration.
The Prime Minister raised the prospect of a new global levy that would enable banks to create an emergency fund to prevent a repeat of the publicly funded bail-outs that have cost the taxpayer billions.

In front of the world's most powerful finance politicians at the G20 meeting in St Andrews, Brown called for the introduction of a transaction tax to curb risky speculation and provide cash for future bail-outs.

The proposal was the Prime Minister's "big idea" to create a fairer relationship between banks and a public which is disenchanted with rescuing failing institutions – most notably the Royal Bank of Scotland and the Lloyds Banking Group.

His plan, which requires international support, faced opposition in the City, where analysts believe that a tax which could be levied on every share, derivative and currency transaction carried out by a bank would damage the money markets.

But most devastatingly for Brown, it was almost immediately rejected by the US Secretary of the Treasury, Timothy Geithner, who said he was not prepared to back it.

When asked about the levy in a Sky News interview last night, Geithner said: "That's not something that we are prepared to support."

Later, the Canadian finance minister, Jim Flaherty, also dismissed the idea.

Brown used the G20 meeting to renew his attacks on the irresponsible risk-taking of bankers, before coming up with his controversial suggestion, which will be worked on by the International Monetary Fund.

"It cannot be acceptable that the benefits of success in this sector are reaped by the few, but the costs of its failure are borne by all of us," Brown said. "There must be a better economic and social contract between financial institutions and the public based on trust and a just distribution of risks and rewards."

Brown said a fairer relationship between the public and the banks could be achieved through four methods.

Those were: an insurance fee to reflect systemic risk; a special "resolution fund"; contingent capital arrangements; plus his preferred option – a global levy on financial transactions, the so-called "Tobin tax".

An insurance fee is the idea that banks, whose performance is crucial to the financial system, should hold more capital than less important ones.

A resolution fund is a pre-funded bank bail-out fund.

A contingent capital arrangement means that, in the event of a disaster, funds are available because of a pre-negotiated agreement, which has seen banks make payment to a second party. It is similar to insurance, but with no transfer of risk.

But Downing Street indicated Brown preferred the Tobin tax, a levy named after the US Nobel Prize-winning economist James Tobin, who was the first to propose it in the 1970s.

Academics have estimated that a levy of £5 on every £10,000 of transactions would raise £415 billion a year.

A long-standing criticism of the tax has been that, unless it was levied across the world, it would result in financial

institutions relocating to countries where it was not enforced.

Brown stressed that in order to work, the measures would have to be implemented by all the major financial centres around the world – including the US, Europe, Asia, the Middle East and Switzerland. "Let me be clear: Britain will not move unless others move with us together," he said.

Almost as soon as Brown announced his transaction plan, its future was in doubt when America indicated that it would not co-operate.

When questioned by the world's press, Geithner was circumspect. He said that America shared the aspiration of other countries to create a financial system that did not expose taxpayers to risk and in which the public did not bear the responsibility for the mistakes of financial institutions.

But, on TV, Geithner shot it down completely.

Lord Oakeshott of Seagrove Bay, the Liberal Democrat Treasury spokesman, said: "Gordon Brown looks humiliated and isolated, a bit-part player on the world stage. Only weeks after his own Treasury rubbished the Tobin tax, he's pulled it out of the hat like an old conjurer desperate for a new trick."

Vince Cable, the Lib Dem shadow chancellor, added: "The Americans clearly aren't going to waste time on something which is simply too difficult to implement."

The Conservatives accused Brown of "chasing headlines". A Tory spokesman said: "Six weeks ago Downing Street poured cold water on this proposal and the Treasury said it was unworkable – what has changed?

"Instead of empty headline-grabbing announcements, Gordon Brown should focus on the crisis we are living through now, which he helped to create, which means businesses are folding and insolvencies rising at record rates."

RBS and Lloyds, which are to benefit from a second bail-out of £30bn announced earlier this month, declined to comment.

Angela Knight, chief executive of the British Bankers' Association, suggested it would be unworkable. "We would have to get every country in the world to agree and say they would implement this in some way," she said. "This came up about 30 years ago and there is a reason it has never been implemented – practically it does not operate."

Oxfam welcomed Brown's call. Senior policy adviser Max Lawson said: "Gordon Brown today signalled that payback time for banks could be just around the corner. A tax on banks would be a major step towards clearing up the mess caused by their greed. The G20 has a responsibility to act. Every minute around the world 100 people are forced into extreme poverty as a result of the economic crisis."

At the G20 meeting at the Fairmont Hotel near St Andrews, Chancellor Alistair Darling urged the world's most powerful finance ministers to treat climate change with the same urgency they gave to the economic turmoil.

Environmental activists staged a protest.

About 20 demonstrators donned suits and ties and buried their heads in the West Sands in an attempt to draw attention to climate change.


Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 07 November 2009 11:13 PM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
 
1

Baggy Troosers,

08/11/2009 00:21:10
Alex Ferguson can help.
2

Handsome Scotsman,

08/11/2009 00:36:26
Gordon always just says whatever he thinks the person listening wants to hear.

Except this time his audience have had enough of his rhetoric and decided to put a stop to his daft proposals before they even get out of the conference room.

Very embarrassing for our delude PM.
3

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 08/11/2009 00:40:34

Thing is!, when people come to vote they will have no interest is gossip like this, it will the tax they will told they will pay, under each political party, the NHS, council tax and services, and the war, gobbledygook, as most will see it in this article will not come into play.



4

Soloman,

Stirling 08/11/2009 00:41:57
Sir Alex has lost touch with Glasgow and Scotland, he now lives in a bubble that most hard working people can only dream of.

Good luck with your football, here's hoping the debt at your club isn't as bad as The UK's.

Vote New Labour in Glasgow

get Lord Mandelson the un-elected crook.

or

X VOTE SNP X

get Independence for all Scotlands people.
5

the_figures_are _fudged,

Galashiels 08/11/2009 01:38:27
So having claimed EVERYONE listened to him and he saved the wold banking system.......


The truth comes out, our prime minister is not as important to the world of finance as he thinks.
6

Eduardinho,

08/11/2009 01:43:53
The media are beginning to turn on Brown, last night's nwes on ITV, queried why exactly was Brown doing at the G20 meeting.It was ONLY for finance ministers. Doesnt he trust Alistair Darling, or was it more to do with photo opportunities 'see me, Im the one that saved the world'
7

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 08/11/2009 01:47:57
It's hard to do, but even I could run a bank at a loss. But when they have a charter to "create money out of nothing" it takes exceptional stupidity.

Billions of £s are bandied about, but to me as a shipbuilder, that's a serious amount of collateral.

All American Marine can build you a state-of-the-art 80' Coastguard ship for a mere £5 million! Scottish money, where is it?

As CEO of Finbar Marine, we couldn't join the € quick enough. Pound sterling is rubber ducked.
8

Jimbo2,

08/11/2009 01:52:12
The Prime Minister raised the prospect of a new global levy that would enable banks to create an emergency fund to prevent a repeat of the publicly funded bail-outs that have cost the taxpayer billions.

Doesn't Brown realise that any transaction tax on banks would be passed on to the customers - so bail outs or levies, the taxpayers still get fleeced either way. Or, being a lover of stealth taxes, is that what he had in mind?
9

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 08/11/2009 03:56:58
All this debt, hedges and derivatives is pure ficticious stuff. It'd be alot cheaper to declare the UK bankrupt, and can we get on with running Scotland?

With his latest book: "A Yearning For Jacob's Son", Ross Robertson has played a brammer!
10

Sean K,

Elgin 08/11/2009 04:10:39
Well, the US financial machine didn't waste any time in killing that idea !

I suspect that Brown knew it was a 'no-hoper' given the powerful opposition of the banks, - so he was on safe ground proposing it.

Gordon Brown has pandered to the banks all his Ministerial life. He encouraged their reckless gambling, refused to control the bonus culture, and robbed taxpayers to bail them out.
11

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 08/11/2009 05:08:03
Poor Brown,

After following his daft advice a couple of times, it seems that the rest of the world has cottoned on to something everyone in the UK already knows.

The Man's a complete idiot.
12

Eugene john,

Borders 08/11/2009 05:13:37
5
Soloman,

get Independence for all Scotlands people.

__________________________________________________

Whilst the majority of Scots want a referendum on the question of independence, the majority of Scots would vote against independence.
13

Ewan Randall,

08/11/2009 05:41:44
(#13) – (Eugene john) –Is it not the case that your assumptions are based only on current figures?

Is it not then the case that those figures are only good if a referendum was carried out at this time?

If that is the case then is it not possible that those figures might shift towards pro independence in the future?
14

Eugene john,

Borders 08/11/2009 06:11:54
14
Ewan Randall

(#13) – (Eugene john) –Is it not the case that your assumptions are based only on current figures?

Yes.

Is it not then the case that those figures are only good if a referendum was carried out at this time?

Yes.

If that is the case then is it not possible that those figures might shift towards pro independence in the future?


Yes, but its also possible that the figures shift further towards anti independence.

15

Sonare,

08/11/2009 06:28:11
... independence for Scotland ... the RBS and HBOS banking scandals have killed the heightening self esteem we Scots were beginning to sense of ourselves this century ... but we are all responsible for this mess, not the leadership alone ...
16

John Cameron,

St Andrews 08/11/2009 06:37:43
It was not only the US who scuppered Gordon Brown's latest cunning plan to save the world. It was also dismissed by the rest of the G20 as old hat and unworkable. His plan to raise yet another international tax was met with derision even by the Russian Finance Minister Kudrin who said: 'Gordon is famous for always raising taxes. It sounds like a good idea, but like many of his suggestions, it will not work in practice.’ The rebuff of the Saviour of the World’s latest call for a new global social contract rather eclipsed the rest of the finance summit.
17

Pender Paul,

Pender Island 08/11/2009 06:48:55
"Later, the Canadian finance minister, Jim Flaherty, also dismissed the idea."
Jim Flaherty doesn't have a brain to bless himself with. Like the entire Conservative government, he takes his marching orders from the Americans. His boss, Stevie Harper is a neoliberal hell bent following American economic policy no matter how stupid. Brown should realize that there is only one way and that is the American way.
18

Nevsky;,

St Petersburg 08/11/2009 07:36:36
Another epic international failure and embarassement for Brown.

The idea that the world would come together to impliment such a scheme is ridiculous, just what is Brown thinking?

Has he been on the mood enhancers again?
19

okanaganguy,

kelowna, b.c. canada 08/11/2009 07:41:49
#18.Paul. We have no reason to support Brown's plan as none of the Canadian banks went bust. I am more worried about our out of control Premier Gordy Campbell taking us to the cleaners with his tax on tax on tax.When the final cost to host the 2010 winter olympics comes in, be prepared to fork over more of your income to pay for it. regards
20

Mcsnagpile,

08/11/2009 07:58:49

They screwed my jobs many times—shut down all our industries
We will do service industry –like prostitution.
They screwed my endowment policies.
They screwed my property.
They screwed my pension.
They screwed my taxes.
They are screwing my bank account.
At least they are not screwing my son with conscription –not yet-- remember Vietnam??
They are very likely working on that one as a side show to the financial pig stye.

I see people wearing expensive suits with grubby under-wear never been washed.

There is no financial system just men with guns and clubs.
Brown's idea will not repair a worn tyre with the walls blown out.

Hey, this had been going on for a life time not two years.

Who says I am depressed??
21

,

08/11/2009 07:59:31
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
22

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 08/11/2009 08:18:10
Brown has totally lost the plot now.
Now he jumps up with a financial tax proposal without asking anybody else around the table what they think of it, as anyone who has ever been involved in negotiations - a recipe for disaster.
He says that it will not affect the tourist buying holiday currency ? If so it will be the first time that a tax has not been passed on to the end user. Can you see the banks absorbing the tax by taking it out of their profits ?
Did you hear his ramblings on Afghanistan a couple of days ago ?
We must stay there in the interests of security in the UK but not unless Karzai puts an end to corruption in his government.
In other words he is waiting to see what the US might or might not do before he commits himself.

23

Ben Thehoose,

08/11/2009 08:21:23
The Brown Touch! The opposite of the Midas Touch.

And now we hear he's taken up jogging. Getting into training to become world heavyweight boxing champion, too, no doubt.

A PM to be proud of, indeed.
24

James the Pie,

08/11/2009 08:31:40
I see the banks are showing the Comrades no sympathy even after pouring billions of our money into them!!

After bankrupting the country they have even managed to bankrupt themselves.

Aye, prudence indeed!!!

From The Sunday Times,

"LABOUR is facing an election crisis after being banned from spending extra money on campaigning. The party has been forced to make drastic cutbacks after expected donations failed to materialise.

It is under strict orders from its banks not to increase spending, despite the looming general election.

Labour MPs defending marginal seats complain they have been “fobbed off” with “DIY tool kits” to make their own campaigning materials and have received no other support from party headquarters because of the cash crisis.
25

TWC,

exLabour 08/11/2009 08:59:44
Brown keeps telling us that everyone is following his lead but they aren't, they're all doing their own thing and they are all out of recession before us.

When we come out of recession it will be in spite of Brown, not because of him.

26

James the Pie,

08/11/2009 09:15:12
Here is another story SoS seems to have missed!

From The Observer,

"Gordon Brown stands accused today of misleading the public over his much-vaunted plans to help young people through the recession. Leaked documents show the government is planning drastic cuts for its flagship plan to train a new generation of apprentices.

Confidential papers obtained by The Observer show that, while Brown and his ministers have suggested they are raising investment in training, skills and apprenticeships, behind the scenes they are preparing some £350m of cuts for 2010-11 that will slash the number of training places on offer by hundreds of thousands.

Last night business groups, unions and opposition parties accused the government of duping young people – and businesses that train them in return for state help with funding – into believing it is investing more during the downturn, when the reverse is the case."
27

SlyFifer,

Somewhere South of Fife 08/11/2009 09:17:38
Brown in a unique piece of work. Under his glorious leader, Blair, he presided over the biggest boom in UK history. Rather than living up to his boast of being prudent he relaxed regulation on the city, sold of all the gold at rock bottom prices, raised taxes to ridiculous levels and nobody seemed to complain. So the kneejerk reaction to problems continue from a party and a government bereft of ideas, Tax it or Ban it. This is all we can expect from our un-elected Prime Minister dipping into his many years of experience in international banking and leading troope into battle. An incompetent of the highest order and still the public don't complain. Just what is wrong with us. After the expenses scandle we need a totally fresh start. New politics, new politicians that can be - trusted !. Support the new Scottish Democratic Alliance, lets see the back of these crass incompetents!
www.scottishdemocraticalliance.org
28

James the Pie,

08/11/2009 09:24:44
Yet another story missed by the SoS!!

From the Mail on Sunday,

"A senior Labour MP made sexually provocative comments to Tory Nadine Dorries, after saying he had dreamt about her the previous night, it has been alleged.

Ms Dorries claimed last week that an unnamed Scottish Labour MP had approached her in the Commons and made ‘disgusting’ comments to her.

And last night sources close to the Conservative MP said the remarks were made by former trade union official Jim Devine, 56, MP for Livingstone in Scotland. Last night Mr Devine denied the allegations."

http://tinyurl.com/yarcbtq
29

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 08/11/2009 09:26:52
Gordon Brown is a towering world statesman and should be respected and followed unlike that little upstart in America.
30

Jo'Burg Jock,

South Africa 08/11/2009 09:49:24

Gordon Brown sold half of Britain's gold reserves at an average price of $275 an ounce.

On Friday, gold touched $1100 an ounce.
_______________________________________________________

You would need to be off your head to believe anything Brown says.

31

James the Pie,

08/11/2009 09:52:17
#30 It's life but not as we know it,

Towering imbecile you mean??

The man who saved the world financial system??
The man who abolished boom and bust??
The man who sold the gold stocks at the bottom of the market??
The man who raided the pension funds??
The man who has bankrupted the UK to the tune of £200 Trillion??
The man who sent troops to die without adequate supplies??
The man who promised an EU referendum??
The man who couldn't be bothered attending 1 coffin homecoming at Wooten Bassett or Brize Norton??
The man who widened the gap between rich and poor??
The man who presided over the worst sleaze scandals in living memory??

Respect???

Contempt, you surely mean???
32

James the Pie,

08/11/2009 09:53:30
#32

Oh and on the plus side,

Comrade Broon prefers The X Factor!!!
33

CoI Blimp Vl,

08/11/2009 10:19:51
#5 Soloman - "Good luck with your football, here's hoping the debt at your club isn't as bad as The UK's."

I think you may have posted on the wrong thread...But alas Manchester United are £700,000,000 in the Red and even the last financial years "operating profit" of £66 million, does not leave them with as much as a penny to go toward reducing their debt.
34

Tris,

08/11/2009 11:36:31
Well Mr Brown. That will teach you to bore Mr Obama to death with your depression.
35

Dijit,

Glasgow 08/11/2009 11:38:25
Who would have ended up paying? The public as the bankers would simply pass it on. Any excuse for a tax.

Anyway what do I know?
Listen to Lord Monckton on what Brown is really up to.

http://2gb.com.au/index2.php?option=com_newsmanager&task=view&id=4998
36

Richard Lionheart,

08/11/2009 12:17:21
Gordon always comes up with new ways to tax us.

Remember that is how he created the Pension Crisis.
37

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 08/11/2009 12:34:37
Slapped down by the US. Slapped down by Canada and even Russia, birthplace of his beloved beliefs thinks his "idea" is a non-starter. Well of course it wasn't his idea in the first place; it is in fact the Tobin tax, which remains untested and therefore suspect. In any case if we went ahead with it ourselves our own banks would soon become uncompetitive against other nations and as usual with his headline-grabbers would become a turkey - very apposite given the season.

He only has this monoideism in his head that he would like to spend major amounts of cash on undeserving "causes" (AGW is tailor-made for him) by overcooking the banking system and taxing us all to the max. And in the process being seen to be the egomaniac saviour of the banking system and the wuhhhld.

In fact we would all be substantially better off if he just packed in and gave us all a break.
38

Expat in Amsterdam,

08/11/2009 12:42:07
#30 ... and what castle in the sky are you living in?

Blair should be tried as a war criminal and Brown, Darling, all the immoral expenses grabbing MPs and all the money grabbing *ankers should be tried as peace criminals.
39

Russell M,

Stirling 08/11/2009 14:11:02
We've already funded the bank bailout. If they where too greedy to realise that, it should be their lookout. The problem is the whole notion of "too big to fail". The solution is in the first two words "too big". No corporation, institution or ministry should ever, EVER, grow larger than 20% of the whole. Failure would still be painful but probably not fatal.

"Too big to fail" has become just another scheme to transfer wealth from ordinary common folk to the nobility and their sycophants.
40

Gary Inserik,

Nova Scotia 08/11/2009 14:59:05
And there you have it. Gordons master plan is to make Britian wealthy and prosperous by taxing money transfers.

The problem being that A)Britain cannot be wealthy by any other means since he's sold all the family silver and B) this only relates to the city of London making the rest of the UK soley dependent upon the city for handouts.

Scotland can go indpendent now as it really doesn't matter anymore since your country is literally focached. It alos doesn't mater who you vote in next time as they simply cannot reverse what Gordon has done to your once great country.
41

Gary Inserik,

Nova Scotia 08/11/2009 14:59:35
PS

To the rest of the world, Great Britian is now a joke.
42

Buckpool Loon,

Cheshire 08/11/2009 15:11:13
I remember watching the TV News a couple of months back. It was dealing with some finance meeting of the G groups and was showing Darling in deep confab with Tim Geithner the US Treasury head. The spin was intended to show the US and UK as shoulder to shoulder and leading the rest of the pack.

However, thanks to a slip up in editing, as soon as Geithner spotted the French Treasury Minister ( I forget her name.) Geithner was seen to dismiss Darling with an arm gesture. The camera stayed on Darling who strutted off looking bewildered and lost like the proverbial rejected wall-flower.

This chance example probably reflects a more accurate indicator of the standing of Brown and the UK in general in the eyes of the Americans and the other Western power brokers. After all, no matter how much you may pet a lap dog you're hardly concerned by either its bark or its bite.

The other issue raised by this article is the continuing arrogance of the financial world. They won't have a tax or regulation imposed on them? They say its unworkable, but they spend billions diminishing their corporate tax liabilities in order to save trillions.

It's not the political lackeys we have to watch, it's their financial masters. They really believe they're Masters of the Universe and they're robbing us blind to prove it.


43

ColinMz,

Edinburgh 08/11/2009 15:16:35
"It cannot be acceptable that the benefits of success in this sector are reaped by the few, but the costs of its failure are borne by all of us,"

Not exactly true - in the profitable times the government happily reaped quite a bit of corporation and income tax.
44

westview,

Against Brown the pension pirate. 08/11/2009 15:35:20
Just think, if Labour has no money left where will they get the sacks for the postal votes ? Perhaps they will tax the computers and every blog sent? Would you pay the British Government a Computer Tax just like the TV licence? Vote for a Brown free Scotland before its too late.
45

danbob,

08/11/2009 15:42:09
Just leaving aside what peoples views on Gordon Brown are. Does anyone else get the feeling that the money institutions have got so powerfull now that even world politicians are frightened of facing them down. You wouldn't have got this 30 or 40 years ago. To me this is very scary stuff. Unless nations are going to get a grip on what has gone in the last decade, this will happen again. What's more frightening is we will still be paying for this one.
46

Big Tam fae The Pans,

08/11/2009 15:51:26
Well Im no fan of Mr Brown, but nowhere does this article make clear WHY it would not work. I can think of a few reasons myself but a quality newspaper would list some, including better responses from the US and Russian finance ministers.

Instead of acting like a bunch of dicks perhaps some of you could now start to come up with viable options.

At least the man is trying.
47

danbob,

08/11/2009 16:04:15
47# Well it would work but all countrys would have to implement it. If this didn't happen you would get banks relocating to countrys that don't levy it. It's like I said in post 46# They are too powerfull by half and all people on here can do is bitch at Brown.
48

CoI Blimp Vl,

08/11/2009 16:48:40
#48 danbob

In other words it would not work.

Unless of course the people who wanted it to work used their countries financial clout and military might to ensure that all countries collected this global tax, whether they wanted to or not.

Perhaps some of the G20 clique are not as committed to the master-plan as Brown clearly is.

49

museum attendant,

glasgow 08/11/2009 21:03:51
please dont pout like that gord pet....you will be offered a role in the next ladyboys tour!
50

Billy Boy,

Sherman Oaks Californiacation 08/11/2009 22:06:54
I have little respect for Mr Brown and for most politicians for that matter, BUT, this was only one of the four suggestions he had to control the dangerous loan practises of the financial industry. His basic premise is spot on, but would it not be simpler to ensure that all of these institutions have enough CASH in reserve to cover everything they have invested in. In fact I thought this was one of the cornerstones of prudent banking procedures!
51

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 08/11/2009 22:28:54


If this is true? Germany is not thriving as Gordy would have us believe.

http://209.85.229.132/search?q=cache:VV4N524w-pYJ:www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp%3FID%3D8120+genocide+of+German+people&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=uk

52

museum attendant,

glasgow 08/11/2009 22:47:29
dont call him prudence!!!
53

ecosseman,

FACTS NOT PROPAGANDA 09/11/2009 10:47:52
BROONS A NATURAL BORN LOSER.

KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK,LOSER.

WHY VOTE FOR LOSERS?

JOIN THE WINNERS IN SCOTLAND,VOTE SNP.

ROLL ON THE ELECTION!

 

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