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Cameron derides PM over 10p income-tax climbdown



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Published Date: 24 April 2008
DAVID Cameron launched a blistering attack on Gordon Brown yesterday over his apparent cave-in to rebel Labour MPs over the 10p tax rate.
During Prime Minister's Questions, Mr Brown was forced to defend the decision to compensate people who have lost out by the removal of the lowest income-tax band, but he insisted he had not been "pushed about" by his back-benchers.

Without any concessions, however, he would have faced defeat over the Budget measure.

The climbdown was pounced on by Mr Cameron, the Conservative leader, who condemned Mr Brown as "a loser, not a leader" and said he had suffered a "massive loss of authority".

But in a series of TV interviews after the heated exchange, Mr Brown insisted that he had not caved in. "I don't think I've been pushed about at all. What I've done is listen and made the right long-term decision," he said.

He stressed that the "fundamental" change of scrapping the 10p tax band, made in his last Budget as chancellor, was still going ahead.

Measures to mitigate the effects of the tax change on 5.3 million people emerged just before Prime Minister's Questions. They will include larger winter fuel payments for pensioners aged 60-64, changes to working tax credits for workers without children and the possibility of raising the minimum wage for younger workers.

All the changes will be backdated to 6 April, when the 10p rate was abolished, but precise details are not expected until the pre-Budget report in October.

Some 45 Labour MPs – more than enough to defeat the government – had signed an amendment from Frank Field, the former Labour welfare minister, demanding a delay in the scrapping of the rate. Mr Field withdrew his motion shortly after the new proposals emerged.

Mr Cameron accused the Prime Minister of "weakness, dithering and indecision" and said the U-turn had been forced on him by a threatened Labour rebellion on this year's Budget.

In the Commons, Mr Cameron referred to the comments last week of the Labour peer Lord Desai, who compared Mr Brown's lumpen style to porridge.

To hoots of derision, he added: "Another week like this and it will be Cheerios. Is this the case that the Labour Party have finally worked out that they have a loser, not a leader?"

But Mr Brown defended the decision, saying 85 per cent of the tax rate's benefits were enjoyed by better-off taxpayers.

Nick Clegg, the Liberal Democrat leader, said afterwards: "In a last-gasp attempt to appease its own back-benchers, the government has cobbled together a set of half promises which will not even be properly revealed for another seven months.

"People who have just seen their tax rates doubled are unlikely to be comforted by the reassurance that the government is going to tinker with an overly complex and failing tax credit system, which people under 25 aren't even entitled to."

A loser not a leader – the schoolboy taunt that hits its target

Gordon Brown must have felt the below-the-belt punch dealt to him by David Cameron yesterday.

The Tory leader taunted him with one of those names that simply sticks: branding him a "loser, not a leader".

In a string of insults, it was the Tory leader's parting shot that inflicted the most damage.

Witnesses could tell. The Prime Minister winced. A depressed looking Des Browne did not blink for about four and a half minutes. (OK, so that was not that unusual). With his back almost turned to the Tory leader, Brown gasped for air, and then resentfully spat back: "Here's the choice – a Labour government that supports the minimum wage, supports tackling child poverty and pensioner poverty and has got three million people in jobs; and a Conservative Party that would go for £10 billion worth of tax cuts, the priority going to stamp duty on shares and not the poorest in the country."

More clunking than punching, one could say.

Years of slugging it out in the debating chambers of Eton means that Cameron excels at schoolboy-style teasing.

Brown's initial fightback was strong. He pointed out the Tories' position on the abolition of the 10p rate had the consistency of quicksand (in duller terms, of course). Even Nick Clegg, whose voice is sometimes inaudible as he stands neither far enough to the left, nor the right (a typical Liberal Democrat affliction) appeared to show gravitas in comparison, asking where were the Labour MPs last year when they had rubber-stamped the Budget?

A rattled Brown stumbled his way through most of the session. He spoke of the "ten spence" rate. And he bragged about lifting nearly a million children out of poverty. According to government figures, it is 600,000. Then again, a decade as Chancellor must hone creative accounting skills, if not leadership ones.

Cameron then used the words of Labour rebels to tease him further: "The Labour peer Lord Desai said your leadership style is like 'porridge'. Another week like this and it will be Cheerios!"

Another PMQs like that, and indeed Brown may be Ready for a Brek.

Gerri Peev

Forced to eat humble pie

WHEN Gordon Brown came to power, he famously promised to listen and learn. Now, after weeks of denying that more than a few MPs had problems with his decision to scrap the 10p tax rate, he has had to do just that.

But the watering down of his proposal has been seized on by opponents as a sign of weakness.

Faced with the choice of eating humble pie or risking a rebellion which would have seen his own Budget voted down, along with his authority, the Prime Minister chose the former.

The most damaging aspect of the 10p tax row for Mr Brown has been the doorstep perception that it affects everyone just days before important local elections south of the Border.

Labour rebel Frank Field said the climbdown marked the start of "phase two" of Gordon Brown's premiership. He had become a "listening Prime Minister".

Mr Brown will have to show he can straddle the fine line between listening, learning and leading.


The full article contains 1035 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
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1

Angus Ogg,

23/04/2008 22:12:49
Is it just me, or is anyone else looking with nostalia at the "Tony Blair Years" when now comparing them with the "Gordon Brown Months" ?

There is coming a point when you stop feeling angry with Gordon Brown and start feeling sorry for him. That, surely is a point when the prime minister is on the slippery slope out of office ?

Maybe time for thinking about what is next for Gordo.... Lord Brown of Ditheringham.

I wonder if after the imminent General Election, the poor old New Labour Party will have a series of Opposition Leaders in the same manner the Tories had....

1. Labour Opposition Leader 2009 - 2011: David Milliband.

2. Labour Opposition Leader 2011 - 2014: Alasdair Darling.

3. Labour Opposition Leader 2014 - 2016: Douglas Alexander.

4. Labour Opposition Leader 2016 - 2016: Wendy Alexander (she got a promotion).

5. Labour Opposition Leader 2016 - 2020: Jack Straw.

6. Labour Opposition Leader 2020 - 2022: Tony Blair.

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JimC,

Kilmarnock 24/04/2008 07:36:44
So Brown again misleads the voters, these half promises will lead to nothing for the many. People will still lose money and the labour rebels throw their socialist principles to the wind. Des Browne has just signed his own death warrant for Kilmarnock and Loudoun . He is now tarred with the same brush as Wendy and dithering Brown.
10

morris,

edinburgh 24/04/2008 07:40:23
PAYE is cumulative.The 10p band was removed and effective from the beginning of the tax year (*April) as far as I am aware.
A simple reinstatement of the 10p band will automatcally repay the correct amount to each individual.
What Brown proposes is hand out a few sweeties to a few people which is an even bigger insult,and any Labour MP who claims that this entire shambles has any credibility should be removed as a liar.
Brown is NOT losing his authority. HE lost that a long time ago.He is losing government and Labour cannot retain power again.They may be OUT for many many years to come.
Its time to tell the Labour Party supporters in Scotland a few harsh truths.
Start with YOU ARE AN IDIOT if you ever vote Labour again.They are a watered down Tory party who are finished .
11

sam the god,

24/04/2008 08:07:54
Miss H

what type of hair cut do you have or is it like a pirates hat
12

it has always been allan,

24/04/2008 08:28:10
I have lost my way again obviously.
personally I like the Yul Brynner.

What about the true Scots woman in a wind?
Get independence and take pathetic brown with you
13

capy,

edinburgh 24/04/2008 08:47:51
does anybody know if you have to apply for these dam credits.my bet is they will rely on a poor take up of credits to let them off the hook. far simpler to udjust the personnel allowance.
14

J.M.,

Cupar 24/04/2008 09:00:38
Gordon Brown famously accused David Cameron of not being able to do simple arithmetic. That accusation has now come back to haunt him. A relatively elementary exercise in adding and subtracting, aided by the sophisticated computer Treasury software would have revealed this dreadful gaff before the ex-chancellor presented his "con-budget".
15

El Sabio,

Sibbertoft 24/04/2008 09:12:10
Listening to Gordon Brown being interviewed on BBC Rdio 4 was interesting.

He tried to skirt and duck around the interviewer's questions. His performance on the interview was pitiful
16

JayDeeTee,

24/04/2008 09:24:29
#13. You can apply to the tax credit people but they will probably f>ck it up and you will end up having to pay it back,
17

JayDeeTee,

24/04/2008 09:27:36
#15. "His performance on the interview was pitiful".

The whole party is pitiful and they are well and truly on the slippery slope out. As #1 Angus mentioned, Tony Bliar almost looks competent when measured against ma Broon. That's how bad things have become for the Liebour Party.
18

MoragtheToerag,

Argyll 24/04/2008 09:30:41
some of us don't think we should have to submit to intrusive financial checks in order to claim BENEFIT to get back the money Crash Gordon continues to take from our purses.

not to mention the HUGE potential for his Tax Credits monstrosity to calculate your 'award' (BENEFITS) incorrectly - there is currently NO way for claimants to calculate the correct amount on their own - and then come back years and years later and tell you that, in addition to paying double the tax you used to pay, you're now due the IR thousands of pounds you can't afford, and they'll be stopping your tax credits (BENEFITS) until you pay back your 'debt'.

Crash Gordon's solution to everything is the enslave as many as he can by his BENEFITS system, then target 'benefits scroungers' at every turn.

Well, we see what you're doing, Gordon, and we'll be voting accordingly!
19

MoragtheToerag,

Argyll 24/04/2008 09:31:38
We don't want benefits, Gordo, we want to keep a fair share of what we earn through our work!

What part of that do you not understand?
20

interstellarmince,

outer-space 24/04/2008 09:34:38
When will you lot wake up. Brown, Browne, the Alexander twins and all the other Establishment messengers are liars and criminals. End of!
21

JayDeeTee,

24/04/2008 09:40:31
#20 And the rest of them. What a mess they have made over the last 11 years. Keir Hardie must be spinning in his grave whilst this lot spin the cr*p in Westminster and Holyrood.
22

interstellarmince,

outer-space 24/04/2008 11:10:02
The Establishment are utterly predictable by their methods which change little over the millennia. Broon’s delibertly sabotaging his position as the Tory Etonian fag takes over the Brotherhood mouthpiece slot. All part of the plan. The Black Nobility controls ALL the Union parties, Unions and Media then choreograph the theatre that is politics. That’s why policies and deeds never change regardless what clowns are vote-rigged into power. We, here in Scotland will have to keep a careful eye on the conspiracy as the Independence prize is at hand. All that matters is independence from the devious Westminster.
23

Red Tower,

Dunoon 24/04/2008 11:49:09
When I was in the Labour Party we used to say that Labour was a crusade or it was nothing. The "crusade" was about helping the poorest in society. However along comes Blair and the "crusade" was about getting "Mondeo man" on board the good ship, New Labour. In short the the Labour Party was converted into a Conservative Party Mark2. That was when I quit.

Now New Labour is getting its just desserts. Defeat at the next election is now a virtual certainty. But what we are going to get in place of the Tory Party Mk2? Why, the Tory Party Mk1! And they never had a crusade other than to recompense the rich at the expense of the poor.

And to think we supposedly do not live in a one-party state!
24

Benedict Arnold,

Paris 24/04/2008 11:49:16
There is no actual commitment to do anything apart from have a look at the situation. The Labour so-called rebels have just caved in, as we knew they would.

So the great Labour storm in a teacup subsides. Business as usual.

Smoke and mirrors. All for show and not for blow.
25

Raymond Thomas Brooke,

Leven England 24/04/2008 11:56:59
The only quality needed to be leader of the Labour Party is have no scruples whatsover a Quality that GB has in abundance and far as the Labour "Rebels" are concerned they really must be no brainers to be fooled into dropping their objections on the whim of a promise to look at compensation for afew.The simple solution of reinstating the 10p rate could have been achieved had they had the courage to complete the challenge.Birds of afeather and lining their own nests springs to mind
26

Mack1,

Carlisle 24/04/2008 12:10:08
Gordon Brown is the architect of his own misfortune: he introduced the 10p band 7 years ago in order to counter the Tories claim to be the party of low taxation. In the 2007 budget, again to trump the Opposition, he announced the reduction in the basic rate from 22 to 20p but omitted to mention the abolition of the 10p band (this was hidden in the small print, a typical Brown smoke and mirrors trick.

At the time only Frank Field pointed out that people without families would lose out; most Labour MP's didn't utter a word of protest. However, now that an election is looming and they fear for their seats they have rediscovered their social conscience. What a complete shower of mercenary charlatans.
27

FLUB,

a rocky outcrop in eastern central Scotland 24/04/2008 12:43:43
#28 Caractacus, how are the ladies of your court?

I actually don't see the Tories getting in by default next time round, like Labour did in 1997, as, quite frankly, you would struggle to get the proverbial cigarette paper between the two of them. Neither of the party's ranks contain anybody who is the least bit impressive or reassuring.

I fear that after the next election we'll see a Parliament that looks like a pick 'n mix counter. It'll be made of of odds and sods, independents, SNP, BNP, UKIP, Plaid Cymru, Monster Raving Loony (here's hoping) etc, etc.

And in the main, none of the above contain anybody whose is impressive or reassuring either, in fact if that were possible, they are probably worse.

Imagine; irrespective of the policies they espouse, if the BNP say, have a sufficiency of elected members to hold balance of power, can you imagine the economy or NHS in the hands of some of these neanderthals? Doesn't bear thinking about. We're effed.

PS #22 wash your hands after that Bob?

28

Calum Crubag,

Dùn Eideann 24/04/2008 12:50:28
Interesting. Even the Tories are more left-wing than Nu Labour.

What does Wendy think?
29

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

24/04/2008 12:54:01
If Brown continues to fekk up as he has done I can't see him making it to the end of the year never mind the next election.
30

John south of Soutra,

24/04/2008 13:20:52
I hear that the old Irn Bru ride at Blackpool Pleasure Baech has just been renamed the Gordon Brown
31

Buckpool Loon,

Cheshire 24/04/2008 13:24:25
In fact the abolition of the 10% tax rate is not the only tax Labour has tried to sneak in on the less well off in society.

Alistair Darling's "Green Levy" on road tax has got far more implications than those spun out at the time it was announced.

Much was said at the time of how it would hit the Chelsea Tractor Brigade by charging them £440 p.a. But there was little or nothing said on the fact that Joe average with his five year old Citreon Xsara Picasso is going to see his road tax rise to £310. Or Mr Familyman with his Ford Focus Duratec !.6 will have to fork out £270.

Now we all know £2-300 more to the Chelsea brigade is a drop in the proverbial. But Mr Joe Average struggling against the odds of fuel hikes and the other stealth taxes is really going to struggle to find the money to keep him legally on the road.

Perhaps that's why they've branded it as a Green Levy. Something that will cut the carbon footprint, not by forcing the Chelsea Tractors off the road but by forcing on to the scrap heap all the bangers that keep the plebs and their families mobile.

It must be something like that because, according to the experts the effect of the green levy, while it will double the revenue to the treasury will only effect the total carbon footprint caused by motorists by -1%. So an increase of £2.4bn in tax gains a eco friendly decrease of 1% of carbon.

Good Lord, at that rate I don't think even the Chelsea Brigade could afford that ratio of tax to minimum emission in order to save the planet. But I suppose once again it'll be the poor who feel the pain and create the gain for the rich to play in. That's socialism for you.
32

ochone,

Sauchie, clack's 24/04/2008 13:35:19
Somebody at the Scotsman should have a word with the folks at the Daily Record who are actually reporting this as a victory for Gordon Brown!

Regarding this whole affair, those Labour back benchers are as bad as Brown, this was known about for a year.

They only took interest as it got closer to an election and both their leader and their party were seen to be slipping in the polls.

They then started playing the Westminster game, for about the first time since any of them got elected they threatend a rebellion, safe in the knowledge that provided there was enough of them Gordon and Co would come up with something that would both enable them to back down and save any future chances of promotion that they think they might have been putting at risk, whilst at the same time being able to portray this as a victory to their constituents, whilst all the time they know that actuilly nothing has been promised but a pig in a poke.

Of course Gordon is hoping that it might prevent any further damage at the local elections down south.

They have once again taken hypocracy to a new low, and to think there are still those who think that this is the best that Scotland can do for itself.
33

The Sprucer,

24/04/2008 14:58:51
As Britney Spears once sung:

[Chorus]:
Gimme Gimme more
Gimme more
Gimme gimme more (repeat 4)

So gimme more Gordon!
34

oddoneout,

24/04/2008 16:31:26
Oh Lord....a lesser spotted conservative in Scotland....haven't seen one of those for ages
35

Mike555,

24/04/2008 17:27:36
Finally listening to the country, conman Broon indeed performs U-turns after all!! Up till last weekend both he and his Chancellor said no changes would be made on this issue. Who will believe them now???

They will still make a hash of it since listening to Yvette Cooper's on Newsnight last nigh it appears that they won't simply just backdate the stolen moneys, but will force people to fill in forms etc to reclaim the tax paid.

When pressed she also failed umteen times to answer simple direct questions on the 10p issue saying lamely that the Treasury would be looking at it.

These people are still not of this planet and Cameron and Co love them.

36

boybilly,

Buckie 24/04/2008 17:42:07
I seem to banned from posting comments. I have had 2 posts today disallowed. What is going on? Anyone else being excluded?
37

boybilly,

Buckie 24/04/2008 17:55:34
OK this time I got posted. Paranoia is not my bag, so what's going on Mr Editor?
38

hertscot,

24/04/2008 20:02:49
36, your strange.
39

hertscot,

24/04/2008 20:03:36
boybilly, your obviously not towing the party line.
40

John Blackley,

Florida 24/04/2008 20:13:36
Oh please! This isn't some David & Goliath parliamentary story, this is a flea on David's dog throwing insults at a flea on Goliath's dog.

Brown is an inept Prime Minister - demonstrably unsuited to lead a political party - and Cameron is a Tony Blair wannabe. The population of Britain is saddled with a two-party system (with all due respect to the LibDems, the Flat Earthers and all the other minority parties) that takes turn-about at abusing the public trust.

While my personal opinion of the SNP isn't relevant to this story, at least they gave the people of Scotland a viable third party to think about. Oh, wait. No. As the Conservatives are all-but defunct in Scotland that's a two-party system as well. Oh well, at least the SNP doesn't carry the same baggage as Labour or the Tories.
41

Red Tower,

Dunoon 24/04/2008 21:39:38
#45 It was the Scottish voting system that gave Scots a viable alternative to Labour.
42

WL,

livingston 24/04/2008 21:41:50
That is the colonial & unionist conservative party attacking the colonial & unionist labour party. Why does Scotland have to be involved in their local English fights?
43

danielrober,

24/04/2008 21:54:03
# 1 Angus Ogg,

I can think of no greater knightmare than David Milliband. A professional member of the labour party who has just done so much damage to our relationship with Russia.

Just pure politics, separated from the economy.
44

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

24/04/2008 22:38:42
#48 Agree with you - Milliband would be a distaer in my opinion.

The thing is - who else could seriously replace Brown?

The only name that I think stands out is Alan Johnson.
45

Tris,

Dundee 24/04/2008 23:04:21
~50

"The thing is - who else could seriously replace Brown?"

My granny's cat?

They need a spell in opposition to get themselves sorted out. There's no one there that would make a Prime Minister.
46

McGinty,

25/04/2008 00:14:26
Brown may be a poor P.M., but Cameron's a scumbag and Westminster's a joke. No decent informed debate. Punch and judy? More like the Young Ones or Shameless. The lunatics have taken over. Belligerent, arrogant, mouthy, pointscoring, childish and pathetic. A bit like some of these threads, especially the Scotsman, in fact the media in general. Or the roads, or the town or the supermarket. In fact we've become a nation of thugs and eejits. In fact we're all screwed. I'm off to bed.
47

Daniel Salaman,

Nicosia Cyprus 28/05/2008 00:02:58
51 McGinty I think you got a point, JUST go to bed. Tomorrow its another day. To much alcohol may damage your philosophy.

 

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