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Labour in retreat as ID card plan is axed

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Published Date: 01 July 2009
THE government was accused of being "in chaos" last night after it all but abandoned its flagship identity card scheme.
In the latest in a series of U-turns and climbdowns from the cash-strapped government, Home Secretary Alan Johnson said the controversial cards would never be compulsory for UK citizens.

The admission came as he shelved plans for a pilot scheme to make airport workers carry the cards, triggering accusations of a "fudge".

The move will also fuel suspicions that the government is purging its least popular policies to go into a general election with a cleaner slate.

Officially, ministers insisted the scheme was still going ahead and that the trial of voluntary cards was even being expanded in north-west England.

Shadow home secretary Chris Grayling said: "This decision is symbolic of a government in chaos. They have spent millions on the scheme – the Home Secretary thinks it has been a waste and wants to scrap it, but the Prime Minister won't let him.

"So we end up with an absurd fudge instead. This is no way to run the country."

Tory leader David Cameron has already written to companies involved in the initial contracts for ID cards, warning them not to invest money in development as his administration will entirely scrap the scheme.

Mr Johnson insisted the climbdown was nothing to do with the £5 billion cost.

He also appeared to concede that the government "should not have allowed the perception to go around that this was a panacea" to tackle terrorism.

As chancellor, shortly before he became Prime Minister, Gordon Brown had said the identity scheme could "help us disrupt terrorists".

Yesterday, Mr Johnson told MPs: "Holding an identity card should be a personal choice for British citizens – just as it is now to obtain a passport.

"Accordingly I want the introduction of identity cards for all British citizens to be voluntary and I have therefore decided that identity cards issued to airside workers, planned initially at Manchester and London City airports later this year, should also be voluntary."

Mr Johnson said the cards would always be voluntary for British nationals. But foreign nationals who live in the UK would still be required to carry them.

He said the cards would help stop illegal working, people trafficking and identity fraud.

Liberal Democrat home affairs spokesman Chris Huhne said: "This is another nail in the coffin for the government's illiberal ID cards policy, which will soon be so voluntary that only Home Office mandarins seeking promotion will have them.

"Airport workers did not want to be guinea pigs for this deeply unpopular scheme, now reduced to nothing more than a second-rate passport."

Former shadow home secretary David Davis said: "Alan Johnson has signalled the final stages of the descent into chaos of the government's ID card scheme.

"The abandonment of the requirement for the ID card to be compulsory as the final stage shows the government has lost its belief in the ID card as a universal check on identity.

"One of the fundamental design flaws in the system was that it had to be compulsory for it to work as advertised.

"Otherwise, how could any public servant, be they police, immigration officer, or welfare provider, demand to see it?"

Anyone wanting a card will pay £30 on top of the cost of having their biometric details taken. The estimated cost is more than £5bn over ten years.

Holders will be able to travel to other EU countries with just the card and no passport.

But civil liberties campaigners Liberty said anyone applying for a passport would still have to have their details stored on the national identity register and was still a form of compulsion.

Isabella Sankey, director of policy for Liberty, said: "The Home Secretary needs to be clear as to whether entry on to the National Identity Register will continue to be automatic when applying for a passport.

"If so, the identity scheme will be compulsory in practice."

SNP home affairs spokesman Pete Wishart pointed to how unworkable the government's policies appeared to be.

"Just a day after he ditched his unpopular and unworkable plans for the privatisation of Royal Mail, we have another massive climb down from the PM over ID cards," he said.

"Not only should he abandon this ludicrous and wasteful scheme in its entirety, Gordon Brown should stop gearing up for an election and call one."

The climbdown follows a series of recent policy reversals by Mr Brown, who marked his second anniversary as Prime Minister on Saturday.

Last week Business Secretary Lord Mandelson was forced to concede he could not get his proposal to sell off part of Royal Mail past Labour backbenchers.

On Monday, the government was forced to remove a clause from its much touted parliamentary standards bill to make the MPs' code of conduct legally binding.

Last week Mr Brown performed a U-turn over holding the Iraq inquiry largely in public after drawing fury from relatives of the war dead.

Background

IDENTITY cards were first mooted by the Tory government led by John Major but were quickly dropped.

The plan was resurrected by the Labour Home Secretary David Blunkett in 2001 and taken up with gusto by his predecessors.

A consultation paper seeking public opinion followed in 2002.

But objections were raised about the scheme by the Information Commissioner Richard Thomas and the former National Technology Officer of Microsoft, Jerry Fishenden, who warned in a Scotsman article that a database would be a honeypot for fraudsters.

Officially the Home Office has revealed it has spent £20 million on the scheme so far, but critics put the true cost is put above £50 million.

While the costs have risen, public support has fallen. A Home Office survey last year found that 60 per cent of the public supported the cards in August but this dropped to 55 per cent by November.

Government under fire over clean-up plan

MPs yesterday accused the government of acting with "indecent haste" in looking to pass a new law in three days to clean-up Westminster in the wake of the expenses scandal.

The move to establish an Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority would remove from Commons officials the role of deciding whether to pay expenses claims submitted by MPs. It would also deal with complaints made by the public and would pay MPs their salaries.

MPs would be forced to declare financial interests in a register and declare interests before speaking or voting.

On Monday night, Justice Secretary Jack Straw, who is piloting the measures through the Commons, was forced to withdraw a clause that would have made a new code of conduct legally binding for MPs, with the threat of up to one year's jail for those who broke the rules.

Commons officials had warned that it could be subject to legal challenges if members of the public did not believe it was tough enough, while MPs complained it could prevent them from speaking out in support of their constituents.

Yesterday Mr Straw admitted that the new laws may have to be rewritten before the end of the year if a wider review into MPs' expenses, being undertaken by Sir Christopher Kelly, the chairman of the Committee on Standards in Public Life, came back with proposals that were more far-reaching.

Senior Tory backbencher Sir Patrick Cormack appeared to speak for many MPs when he complained at the speed the government was pursuing the reforms.

Many MPs believe they should ultimately be answerable to their electorates at election time and not to a quango.

Sir Patrick said the government was taking a bill with "significant constitutional significance through the House at a gallop", adding that there were "widespread concerns in all parts of the House about what they are doing".


Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 01 July 2009 12:01 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Identity cards
 
1

Nevsky;,

Moscow 30/06/2009 22:06:28
Another day another Labour u-turn. I have a feeling that Brown will lead Labour to an even worse election defeat than anyone can imagine.

I have never ever witnessed a government so inept, out of touch and so incapable of governing as this one.

The point will come when people will take to the streets and demand an election under this man..he is leading the country into civil unrest!

Some man, some failure!
2

Mikko,

Drumnadrochit 01/07/2009 00:08:02
Zanu Labour should simply announce the death of the ID card but I guess that Lord President Mandy can't bring himself to do it. It doesn't really matter; it's dead now anyway. Funny, it's now not compulsory so all these terrorist chappies are going to opt for one and splash out £30? What a farce. And suddenly we can all still travel to the United States without one so that was another lie.
3

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 01/07/2009 00:12:44
My only fear is that we get ID Cards by stealth. What happens if government departments start requiring ID cards to get benefits, licence your car, get your kids into school, keep your government job etc, etc. What if What happens if banks require and ID card to open a bank account.

Then you get people getting ID Cards "voluntarily". There should be a firm rule that ID Cards are not compulsory.
4

Forward not Back,

01/07/2009 00:28:47
ID cards have bitten the dust because of the disastrous state of the economy. Watch now as Labour is forced to cut spending as foreigners are busy selling UK debt. Were it not for the BoE creating money out of thin air to buy the debt, the UK would have defaulted already.
5

Iainbroch,

01/07/2009 00:29:07
So how much has this sad excuse for a govt wasted on these cards that no one except for Nu Liebore fascists wanted?
6

S lomax,

cheshire. 01/07/2009 00:35:27
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha brown you commy bast*rd ! you lose.........again. get used to it!
7

Jerry Springer,

01/07/2009 00:40:58
3 For Scotlands Future,Vote for the SNP 01/07/2009 00:12:44
My only fear is that we get ID Cards by stealth. What happens if government departments start requiring ID cards to get benefits, licence your car, get your kids into school, keep your government job etc, etc. What if What happens if banks require and ID card to open a bank account.
==============================================

Why do you have fear?

What do you have to hide?
8

foxbat3000,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 00:51:51
Congrats on getting that one removed just as well as ppl would imagine you to be a deeply troubled and alarming person. He's got to fear you obviously.
9

Highland Len,

dalmally 01/07/2009 00:54:09
Everyone and I mean Everyone has something to hide. Now Picture this. The infalible ID system messes up and you are a criminal or terrorist. Who would belive you over a £5 billion computer system.

Anyhow and we believe the Government about this, why?
10

One-man-bucket's older twin,

01/07/2009 00:57:19
#3 is right - they couldn't impose ID cards, so they'll make it impossible to carry out any transaction without one, and then say people have chosen to have them.

What we fear, #8 is loss of privacy, and loss of identity when the criminal element, aided by government incompetence, start stealing our details and/or selling them to those who have no right to have them.
11

tartangladbach,

edinburgh 01/07/2009 01:06:05
another waste of millions, another policy never thought through, another example of an administration well out of it's depth. westminster has proven time and again, it's a waste of money. being big does not get the best for scotland, simply holds us back.
12

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 01:39:46

We will no-doubt see and hear of more reversals, such as this one, as one has to, 'Put_the_Icing_on_the_Cake', to 'Butter_Up' the elector, a very Clever Move from a Shrewd Scotsman!

13

Fletty73,

Stirling 01/07/2009 02:06:51
The fact is labour have made an a*se of every single thing they touch.

Their time is up. Just get the hell out of office and don't stand for re-election. Please.
14

,

01/07/2009 02:09:31
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15

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 02:30:04

Mentioned by #16 Jorina,

"They want to be a police state"

So-Do-Too! Does our Scottish Government, but unlike Brown, our Salmond has NO 'Hat_Tricks' Up His Sleeve, and to-which the Why? of Never being an Independent Scotland.


16

,

01/07/2009 03:25:02
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17

,

01/07/2009 04:50:25
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18

letmein,

hinterland 01/07/2009 05:24:26
Sorry Suzanne or Jerry Springer or Rufus t Firefly or the Creature from The Dark Lagoon. Your time is up!
An excellent idea? just talk about pooh, thats what you are good at,you disgusting creature.
19

,

01/07/2009 05:35:14
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20

Pocket Dictionary,

01/07/2009 05:49:12
Fife Council needs to to something about their ID cards because there is no uniformity. Some employees are issued with a digitised one, others a flimsy paper one, with details written on it and sealed in a self-laminating pouch.

Ironically those working with the most vulnerable carry the paper one. With its faded photo and faded handwritten details identifying the bearer (if it still legible).

With all the child protection issues these days, an inadequate form of identificaion is carried by social workers in Fife.
21

steve 1511,

aberdeen 01/07/2009 06:04:08
comrade broon the gibbering eejit with the big banana smile is not fit to run a message, never mind the country.

STRAIGHT JACKET FOR BROON
22

,

01/07/2009 06:04:50
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23

McNasty,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 06:52:39
Our beloved leader should be adored by his admiring population for the way he has managed to dupe us all, for so long. That requires talent of a higher order than most ordinary men.

Perhaps we should have a statute of himself on a high plinth in every town centre?
24

Haggismaker,

Northern Bohemia 01/07/2009 06:55:30
ID cards should never have been introduced. That they are on the way out is the best news of 2009.
25

,

01/07/2009 07:08:22
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26

Jerry Springer,

01/07/2009 07:15:57
#18
Hey BA1 (TRAQUIR) what happened to your Tinyurls???

You not using them any more? Using direct links instead?

Do you think that will fool the moderator?
27

Jerry Springer,

01/07/2009 07:18:30
#27 Do you think we should adopt the German Model for ID cards?
28

bonnietiler,

01/07/2009 07:24:16
But why are the Edinburgh trams going to stop at Gogar, and not go all the way to the airport?
29

,

01/07/2009 07:25:50
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30

Dillipod,

London right now 01/07/2009 07:45:17
Just returned from Spain.
You need ID card or passport to buy a SIM card.
You need a passport or ID card if you are paying a cash amount over euros 1500 to reputable organisations.

Needless to say there are a lot of disreputable organisations and now that roaming charges are largely abolished, and you can buy a UK sim card for 0.00p, there's ways round all this futility---if you don't want big brother watching you.

Nothing to hide, but I hate this stuff, and will try and get round it if I can.

31

,

01/07/2009 07:49:40
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32

,

01/07/2009 07:52:07
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33

i wear trousers not a skirt,

dining with two jobs salmond ( who paying alex sco 01/07/2009 07:53:36
id cards might have been ok for checking up on all foreign immigrants that seek to live in the uk. but alot of foreigners passports and birth certificate will be fake anyway.so that wont stop terrorism. i was never in favour of id cards as most people have a british passport ( that has risen from £19 to £77 since new labour came to office )the increase in the passport was to make it harder for id fraud and to fight terrorism. to me id cards was a money making scam from the government
34

Dillipod,

London for now 01/07/2009 07:55:12
The Spanish seem to use the ID instead of a passport for travelling in Europe...I think our Border Agency (don't ask how effective THEY are) accepts ID Cards from EU Countries.

How you get a Spanish ID card, I don't know, but probably you can get one from Abdul of the Thousand Fingers in Barcelona.
35

Andrew Morton,

Berkshire 01/07/2009 08:00:24
About time they dropped this deluded madness!

I noticed that one of Scotlands other tabloids (the Daily Red One) was making a big deal about some ex con that couldn't get his scratch card winnings as he had no ID.

While they didn't say it directtly, it was a poor attempt to supports Labours ID card scheme i.e. "if he had an ID card, he could get his winnings no problem".

What a lot of keech.

As for the "if you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear" brigade - can I come round your house tonight and have a look around? Since you have nothing to hide, it should be no problem then, eh?

Please, post your address on these boards, since you have nothing to hide.

Also, I presume you leave the doors unlocked, so I'll let myself in.
36

,

01/07/2009 08:00:57
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37

donnelly,

01/07/2009 08:47:07
#14 Charles ....was thhat a spelling error you made a the end ? ,,,should we read Screwed not Shrewd.

And Susan ( or should we call you Mr Brown) can we take it you dont like Alex Salmond ...
38

muppetspotter,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 09:02:48
Thank god for that - somthing we all agree on. Hurrah for the demise of the biggest threat to our democracy in years.

The one question the labour govt have been unable to answer is quis custodes ipsos custodiet....who polisis the polis? ID cards all nice an good when we're in charge and can control them but what if that horrible Mr Griffin and his mob got hold of them? The only tragedy is that it took the state running out of money to kaibosh this scheme rather the serious questions over security and the small matter of a lack of a written constitution to protect us plebs.
39

,

01/07/2009 09:08:32
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40

Herry Oaksters,

01/07/2009 09:24:29
Looks like Broon has a dose of the ubendy bug.
41

Phil C,

01/07/2009 09:29:00
More Labour incompetence. This one only cost £50 million!!!!

42

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 09:32:17
Interesting comments/links on today's Indidependent Newspaper.


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/compulsory-id-cards-plan-ditched-1725567.html

For an unbiased overview of why i.d. cards may not do what they are supposed to do
http://www.openrightsgroup.org/orgwiki/index.php/Biometric_passport
43

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 01/07/2009 09:52:19
I just wonder if there is anything that Broon and his incompetent cohorts ever do which is not connected with a) personal political survival and lovely soundbites or b) The Liebore party. The ID card non-system is a case in point. If it's voluntary why continue to gather data from passport applications or changes? Surely this runs counter to one of the Data Protection Act principles which is that you only retain personal data which is vital to the functioning of your business and for no longer than it has to be.

There may be a view that when the Conservatives have sorted out the economy again following the positively dunce effort made by Broon & Co., that they can have a second go at resurrecting corpse? Assuming anyone would vote the miscreants in ever again. Still I can never underestimate the intelligence of Fife and Glasgow voters in this respect.

They couldn't make the id cards work and they can't bin them properly either. Truly the definition of incompetent and it must have cost us a small fortune to get to this point. Still it's not his money after all!
44

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 10:14:13
"IDENTITY cards were first mooted by the Tory government led by John Major but were quickly dropped.

The plan was resurrected by the Labour Home Secretary David Blunkett in 2001 and taken up with gusto by his predecessors."

Isn't that typical? The Tories think of something and either impliment it cautiously or decide against it and then stupid labour go with it blindly like a bull at a gate.

If I recall correctly, the exact same thing happened with the fuel price escalator---the Tories planned to use it to harmonise our fuel prices with the rest of Europe. Stupid labour carried it on so that we now have the most expensive fuel in the world---and they are still at it.

And it was the same story with speed cameras---the Tories installed them in accident blackspots only, as an experiement to see if they would work. Despite them having little or no effect, once stupid labour saw the revenue raising potential, they rolled them out across the country, along with sweeping speed limit reductions.

When will the electorate of this country ever learn?
45

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 10:15:01
and it should be "sucessors", not "predecessors"
46

daffy_b,

01/07/2009 10:31:26
#35 - to answer your point

Spain is part of the SHENGEN agreement between contries, where 24 European countries (incl Switzerland and Lichtenstein) have agreed that a national-ID card is acceptable proof of ID instead of a passport.

Spain is a Shengen country

Britain is not Shengen, so even with ID cards, we'd still need a Passport as our proof of ID to travel to Europe.
47

Tris,

01/07/2009 10:59:21
#7. On the basis of the record of the British Government, you have a lot to fear. They collect information on you and then some idiot leaves it on a disc in his case on the train; or that the substandard system added to the cheap equipment that they use to produce and read the cards will mix them up and you not only won't be able to prove who you are, but will immediately be suspected of being Icelandic, and therefore, by Brown's definition, a terrorist.
48

donnelly,

Dundee 01/07/2009 11:09:31
#35 & #47...although not disputing your travel experiences and requirement to show these items, I myself have travelled frequently overseas and as such once showing my passport intially at Dover or in France, i have then driven through and stayed in hotels in ....France, Germany, Holland, Poland, Czech, Slovakia, Hungary, Romania and not once been asked to show my passport or anything else ? ...only thing I ever showed was my Credit Card followed by 4 code numbers which seem to suffice admirably. Does therefore seem to appear this Spain place is not very sociable to visit and will certinaly look to give it w a wide berth.

Additionally deriding the ID Card and one of its famous potrayed myths by Labour in regard to checking on immigrants ..the only ones that did require this criteria were "non EU members" ..and off these candidates,,, they had to have an ID card issued prior to freedom of movement entry in the UK anyway, or for longer termed resident stay, they had a stamp in the country of origin passport ...so for government to say this was a criteria for their promotion was incorrect and somewhat an admission to incompetance in the first instance if people with non resident status were allowed to roam free.

In short gald this nonsense has finally ( Hopefully !!!) been "put to bed" as it was just nonsense from day one..since my confusion was, if you were a British Citizen ( as per the London Bombers ) how on earth would this magically help to prevent their crimes ? ...secondly if you were a tourist or EU citizen inent on crime ...you would not need one anyway ...so were was this majic solution coming from ???
49

donnelly,

Dundee 01/07/2009 11:11:24
#48 ...ha ha ..well commented Tris
50

Tris,

01/07/2009 11:30:24
#50... thanks donnelly.... it would be funny if it weren't true.
51

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 11:33:14
From the Guardian, Clip featuring Alan Travis on Home Secretary Alan Johnston's claim for ID Cards..

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/audio/2009/jul/01/id-cards-passport-alan-johnson

The usual spin from both Liebore and Tory.
52

Willie Mor,

01/07/2009 11:43:48
What is not being talked about is the huge amount of money ALREADY spent on the ID project.

Nor has there been any talk of the huge costs that still have to be borne to cancel contracts already signed with IT companies.

Just more waste of hard earned monies foregone in taxes.
53

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 12:22:48
Latest news from No.2ID
+ AN OPPORTUNITY TO HALT THE ID SCHEME +

There have been rumours that the new Home Secretary Alan Johnson is "reviewing the ID card" programme. They have been denied, but there is
undoubtedly a change of heart among many back bench Labour MPs. In the last three months several new ones have said openly - against party policy - that the project should be cancelled.

Now they have a chance to show they are serious. There is a chance to
halt it, at least temporarily. A delay at this stage should go a long way to killing the scheme.

The Identity Cards Act 2006 was never a complete system. It left vast amounts about the card, and the database, enrolment and enforcement, to
be determined in regulations. The first batch of those regulations has appeared and MPs will be able to vote against them at a debate scheduled
for July. Together they are far longer than the act itself, and there are numerous points of revealing detail and sheer bad drafting which give scope for legal and political attack. If the regulations are not
approved by parliament the whole scheme will be stalled.

Please write to your MP now, *particularly if you have a Labour MP* and
ask them to vote against the new statutory instruments that would allow the ID scheme to begin.

It is easy to contact your MP via http://www.writetothem.com/

Those key regulations are:

The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Application and Issue of ID Card and
Notification of Changes) Regulations 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111480427_en_1
[The detail that you will have to give to the Home Office about yourself, much much more than the "basic identifying information" ministers keep referring to.]

The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Prescribed Information) Regulations 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111480434_en_1
[What will be kept on the cards - but not yet anything about the national identity register database and how it might work.]

Th
54

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 12:26:26
cont/
The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Designation) Order 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111479056_en_1
[The first of potentially many such. Provides for some people to be forced onto the system because joining will be a condition of *applying*
for another official document that they need.]

The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Fees) Regulations 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111479070_en_1

The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Information and Code of Practice on
Penalties) Order 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111479087_en_1
[The unfair rules that will be used to punish non-compliance.]

The Identity Cards Act 2006 (Provision of Information without Consent) Regulations 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/draft/ukdsi_9780111479063_en_1
[Sets out who the information may be passed to once the IPS has it.
Audit trail information will go to: police, intelligence services, and
SOCA, *and to anyone else they authorise* - so we are immediately beyond
government promise - plus HMRC, who can't however authorise it to be
given to third parties. Further, non-audit trail information - such as
document numbers, names and addresses, signatures and fingerprints,
quite enough to be keys for other searches or massive identity fraud -
may be provided to the Home Office and MoJ, DWP, DoT and FCO. Records of
what information has been given to whom and why may be destroyed after
12 months or less.]

The Immigration (Biometric Registration) (Amendment) Regulations 2009
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2009/uksi_20090819_en_1
[Expands the 'ID cards for foreigners' system vastly by extending it to
more categories of people (for example, spouses of British citizens,
visiting artists and academics) who are only being treated as a threat
in order to justify ID cards for all.]
------------------------------------------------------------------------

+ What just happened? +


+ Sheffield City Council pass
55

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 12:28:01
+ Sheffield City Council passes anti ID and database state motion +

Sheffield City Council has voted to reaffirm its existing motion against
ID cards. The new motion specifically criticises the Manchester ID card
trials and ensures that Sheffield City Council will not take part in any
similar motion. The motion also criticises ID scanning at clubs and
pubs, fingerprinting in schools and Automatic Number Place Recognition
(ANPR) systems. Councillor Paul Scriven said: "Labour's plans to force
the ID card on us is a waste of money and it won't stop crime or
terrorism". The former Home Secretary and grandfather of the ID scheme
David Blunkett is the MP for Sheffield, Brightside.
More at
http://yorkshireno2id.net/2009/06/05/sheffield-council-votes-to-stop-database-state/


+ Constitution Committee responds to government's response +

The House of Lords Constitution Committee has published an analysis of
the government's response to the committee's 'Surveillance: Citizens and
the State' report. The document states: "We regret that the Government
have not agreed to a number of important recommendations which sought to
assist the executive in promoting the responsible and proper use of data
processing, including data sharing, together with other modes of
surveillance".
See
http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200809/ldselect/ldconst/114/114.pdf
56

Boab,

Glasgow 01/07/2009 12:55:35
Thank God ID cards have been dumped. Stay out of our emails too. And stop jailing people for visiting the wrong websites (see: Mohammed Siddique from Alva).
57

Tartan Viking,

01/07/2009 12:56:49
Dear dear dear. What a mess. Another U turn. Another badly thought out idea that was never going to succeed, despite Jackboots' claims it would.

What a disgrace this Lyebour mob are, not fit for purpose, nor competent in any shape or form. I hope the public learn (yet again) never to put your trust in this party ever again. Ever.
58

Tartan Viking,

01/07/2009 12:58:20
#57. They are probably monitoring your texts too.And probably this site.
59

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 01/07/2009 13:11:58
This is Brown at his weasly worst.

He fears that the people will punish him for ID cards at the next GE. His answer is to take cover and let one of his ministers take the flak.

How they must despise him!
60

S.M.D.,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 13:19:34
Total waste of money!
Just think, what else they could have done with those £50mill....
Those coming unlawfully into this country, generally end up having fake ID anyway, so what was the point of having the ID system in the first place?
And why should those from other Eu country's, who have lived here for decades, now be forced to use [and pay for] ID cards?
61

S.M.D.,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 13:21:11
Does anybody actually read all the waffle from 'Beachcomber'?

62

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 13:53:01
S.M.D. Makes no dfference to me if perceive this to be waffle (which its not btw)

Keep wearing the Red Rossette, fool.
63

Joe Plaice,

the Nutmeg of Consolation 01/07/2009 14:14:47
If you want to know hoe the country is REALLY run and for whom, please watch John Harris teaching us how deep the rabbit hole really is. Are you going to take the red pill or the blue pill?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0IM7Hobd_k
64

Joe Plaice,

Nutmeg of Consolation 01/07/2009 14:15:53
'how' ,(although the country is a bit like a dirty whooer too).
65

MacGhillieBhain,

Aberdeen 01/07/2009 15:10:23
ID cards- the favourite tool of the enslaver.This brings to mind the police tactics in South Africa in the aparthied era.In times of acute labour shortages,the police rounded up thousands of native and coloured men then tore up their passes. Subsequent court appearances resulted in lengthy jail terms for those unfortunate enough to be caught.(labour shortage solved).The present cabinet still hanker after ID cards no matter what they say.If re-elected they will come back to them time and time again.I personally will not vote for any party that doesn't finally ditch this odious leglislation.
66

Willie Mor,

01/07/2009 17:36:40
If ID cards were good for apartheid South Africa they will be good for apartheid Britain.

I mean with ever polarizing class of 'haves' who are above the law of the land, ID cards will be essential for controlling the lumpen 'have nots'

So do not fear, the scheme will at some time in the future be back on the agenda - just like the traffic cameras, internet surveilance, e-mail surveilance et al already in place.
67

Ugly George,

01/07/2009 18:04:22
ID cards are not being "scrapped", they are just being made non-compulsory, don't think for one minute that you will not require one, when you want to buy a house, book into a hotel, apply for credit or hire a car.

Uncharacteristically smart move - The stealth awsweis.

http://www.german-way.com/ident.html
68

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 18:10:57
If the Gnats have it their way we will need one to visit aunty Mabel in Bridlington.

They will say you are lucky not to need a Passport.
69

Tartan Viking,

01/07/2009 18:42:08
Just wondered now that Bambi Bliar is cavorting about Europe, anybody know if he has found these weapons of mass destruction yet?
70

billalba,

fife 01/07/2009 19:11:03
#69 If you had any idea it would be great...haven't you followed this debate over the years......Westminster was told that if they introduced ID's that anything the Government in Scotland was responsible for would not need an ID card for?? but don't let facts get in the way of your cringing little british rant.
71

Virgil,

West Vancouver 01/07/2009 20:22:08
As an old curmudgeon I can remember that during WW2 we did have Identity Cards and then subsequently they were declared not necessary. Interestingly these cards did not contain a phtograph and when the Minister Ernest Bevin was asked why?, he stated in his answer that their is a limit to invading the privacy of citizens. Now that sentiment is no longer an option and we have responded by accepting paranoia. Now as an ex-pat Canadian citizen I am still allowed to retain a British Passport and can travel to the UK freely on either one. But only a Canadian Passports or Enhanced Provincial Driving Licences are accepted at the Canada/US Border. The latter document is for Canadian residents who have not yet attained Citizenship. Confusing? You bet! The result of this bureaucratic requirement has led to long waits to cross from one country to another and since the delinquents/terrorist attempting to cross is 0.1 per million they are the real beneficiaries of this scrutiny. I believe that we have to pause and think where we might end as we move closer and closer to sharing the home of Big Brother.
72

Beachcomber,

Edinburgh 01/07/2009 21:36:52
#71 Well said.
73

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 01/07/2009 22:15:52
Oh ffs. You need a birth certificate and a photo id verification from a "suitable person" to get a passport. ID cards are internal passports which just happen to be valid for EU domestic travel.

Funny thing is, most EU ID card carrying citizens travelling to and from Britain usually present their passports. Wonder why.

Anyway, I reckon the magic word here is BIOMETRIC. ID cards as photographic and signature evidence of who you are are in common use anyway and no one is complaining about them.
74

Mikko,

Drumnadrochit 01/07/2009 22:38:11
To any of you who agree with ID cards, why not go and relieve yourselves on our wargraves? Those fine people fought for our liberty and freedom and you don't give a jot for it.You are a disgrace.
75

Pilrig,

Livingston 03/07/2009 21:33:11
18 = Big Brother's Wee Sister !
76

Pilrig,

Livingston 03/07/2009 21:34:24
69 = Ugly George Orwell !
77

Pilrig,

Livingston 03/07/2009 21:36:15
74 - especially not oor civil servant masters, it'll help them keep their jobs.

 

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